Inland MI Lake

[chords]

John -

Can an ice and snow covered 10,000 + acre lake in Lower MI influence cloud cover over that lake during a calm day weather period ?

I have noticed a pattern when ice fishing where its clear blue sky above the lake surrounded by puffy cumulus. I realize clouds can be more crowded looking towards the horizen. I say the frozen lake surface absorbs heat and reflects it upward and opens the sky and my buddy says "no way "

Thanks, chords

 

[frnash]

… I say the frozen lake surface absorbs heat and reflects it upward …

Absorbs heat and reflects it?

It can't do both at the same time, it's kind of an either or proposition. In general, if ice free, it'll absorb heat (or shed heat, depending on the surrounding air temperature), but if iced over it'll reflect it! (If I've got my 'fizzix' right!)

 

[chords]

Absorbs heat and THEN reflect its. Its an in between proposition. There is no but... it's iced over.

 

[jd]

First off, I get to correct frnash!!!

It is possible to both absorb and reflect energy from the sun. It just happens at different wavelengths. The snow will absorb little in the way of the suns visible energy and reflect or refract most of it. Same thing goes for the long wave or infrared energy (stuff we feel as heat). The shortwave (ultra violet) is absorbed, reflected and refracted. Remember that little thing about energy neither being created nor destroyed Mr. Nash?

So getting back to the question. Depending on what the environment is like surrounding the lake, it could be possible for the lake to inhibit cloud formation more than the surrounding landscape. This would happen because the snow on the lake does not absorb much of the suns energy and thus does not give much off in the way of infrared energy (or heat) and thus the air is not heated as much. The lack of heating to the air would inhibit any upward movement of the air and thus limit clouds. If the landscape surrounding the lake has a less reflective value (something like dense trees, or better yet, bare ground) then the suns energy is absorbed more by these objects and then radiated back as heat and can lead to better conditions for cloud growth.

Hope this makes sense.

-John

 

[dcsnomo]

Mostly what I got outta this is that Nash got corrected!

 

[frnash]

Mostly what I got outta this is that Nash got corrected!

Hmmm, "different wavelengths" — okay, score for the day: John: 1, FRN: 0.
Ya can never learn more than ya do by makin' "misteaks" and learnin' from 'em! Bring it! Thanks, John!

 

[lenny]

technically, "surface regeneration" of total rectification, harmonics congealing in a circular mass inhibits profratoracation providing a metamorphic transduction of ,,,,,lets say atomic nucleation (to the lay person). Lastly, as radiant fluorescent biomass incrementally exhausts it's energies, sedimentary striations converge with panelled coagulants providing enough venereal ratification to reduce' the gases to escape. So, In theory both John and Nash are on to something,,,,ie

 

[dcsnomo]

technically, "surface regeneration" of total rectification, harmonics congealing in a circular mass inhibits profratoracation providing a metamorphic transduction of ,,,,,lets say atomic nucleation (to the lay person). Lastly, as radiant fluorescent biomass incrementally exhausts it's energies, sedimentary striations converge with panelled coagulants providing enough venereal ratification to reduce' the gases to escape. So, In theory both John and Nash are on to something,,,,ie

You had to edit because of your "two testicles???"

 

[lenny]

You had to edit because of your "two testicles???"

dat's goooooood,,,,real goooood

 

[jd]

Ok, to simplify things just a bit... Think of two cars sitting out in the sun on a warm and sunny summer day. One is painted black and the other white. The surface of the black one will be much hotter as the darker color absorbs more of the suns energy than the white one.

Now apply the same concept to a lake covered in snow vs. bare ground or perhaps a dense forest. The bare ground will heat up faster or more and that will then heat the air, which will rise and lead to better chances for cloud formation.

That is as long as the air parcel is lifted adibatically through an atmosphere with a lapse rate that is greater than or equal to the standard lapse rate and as long as the air parcel is lifted to the lifted condensation level and...

-John

 

[lenny]

I see,,,, but how about the saturation of polygraphic flatulation in conjunction with albithromatic dilation offering a parallel equilibrium effect thus providing philanthropy's a pathway to rise within the atmospheric bliss?

 

[jd]

I see,,,, but how about the saturation of polygraphic flatulation in conjunction with albithromatic dilation offering a parallel equilibrium effect thus providing philanthropy's a pathway to rise within the atmospheric bliss?

That could be a factor too.

-John