keweenaw_cvb
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Keweenaw ATV Trail Maps
- Thread starter keweenaw_cvb
- Start date
I just received the KATV trail map.There are some inconsistencies I would like to question.First the map states the trails shown are only open to atv's,no dirt bikes,including the J.Stevens and Freda,However the Freda trail and Jack Stevens trail both on the DNR map as DNR designated ORV routes.So which is it?Second what exactly does a "DNR endorsed trail" indicate?
fishh633, I got my map and am wondering the same thing?? Seems strange 2 wheelers aren't legal to ride on the KATV club trails. Can someone clarify this for us? What a shame if we can't ride 2 wheelers in the Keweenaw and enjoy the scenery up there. If I would have known that 2 wheelers weren't allowed I'd have never requested a map.
nytro
nytro
Unlike most other ATV/UTV trails in MI, the KATV trails use private land almost exclusively. Two wheeled vehicles generally cause more damage to the land than do 4 wheeled vehicles and the landowners want to keep the damage to a minimum. Thus the rule against 2 wheeled vehicles. We have plenty of beautiful roads to ride the 2 wheelers on.
DNR endorsed trails means that the DNR does not own the land. In this case the KATV club did all the leg work to establish legal easements to use the land for ATV/UTV usage, not the DNR. The DNR does recognize and endorse the trails.
-John
DNR endorsed trails means that the DNR does not own the land. In this case the KATV club did all the leg work to establish legal easements to use the land for ATV/UTV usage, not the DNR. The DNR does recognize and endorse the trails.
-John
How does a 2 wheeler tear up the land worse then a 4 wheeler??? 2 wheels that are 4-6 in. wide or 4 that are 10+ wide?? The trails I ride where the 4 wheelers also ride are tore up alot worse from 4 wheelers then 2 wheelers. Sucks for us I guess, realy wanted to ride the Keweenaw on the bike.
nytro
nytro
Thanks for the reply's.It is unfortunate that the land owner's are misinformed as to the damage issue but it is their property.Excluding two wheelers leave's a whole segment of the orv community out the local economic picture.
I still think the Freda and Calumet/Hancock route is open to all orv's as they have been since before katv was even founded and this is misrepresented by the map.DNR grant funding info will clear this up I'm sure.
Regardless the katv has put together a nice system,it certainly had to be a lot work and my hat's off to them.
I still think the Freda and Calumet/Hancock route is open to all orv's as they have been since before katv was even founded and this is misrepresented by the map.DNR grant funding info will clear this up I'm sure.
Regardless the katv has put together a nice system,it certainly had to be a lot work and my hat's off to them.
I'm not going to get into the debate about which does more damage as if they are properly ridden, neither should cause ANY damage.
With that said, most of the "land owners" are land companies, meaning they buy up huge tracts of land and then have them logged for profit. They are not new to the business of managing their land, so I would venture to guess that their experience have led them to the restrictions they ask for.
A very good argument against 2 wheel is that their footprint is much smaller and the PSI put on the ground by those smaller tires is much greater than an ATV- even at a lighter weight. Plus it is much easier to spin the tires of a dirtbike vs. most ATV's or UTV's. That is just the pure science of it.
However, you are all welcome to your own opinions and I am not going get into a long drawn out argument on it. Wish it was different, but I respect the landowner and am grateful to them for allowing any type of trail to be used on their land. They have absolutely nothing to gain by allowing it to happen, so I consider it a very generous gesture.
-John
With that said, most of the "land owners" are land companies, meaning they buy up huge tracts of land and then have them logged for profit. They are not new to the business of managing their land, so I would venture to guess that their experience have led them to the restrictions they ask for.
A very good argument against 2 wheel is that their footprint is much smaller and the PSI put on the ground by those smaller tires is much greater than an ATV- even at a lighter weight. Plus it is much easier to spin the tires of a dirtbike vs. most ATV's or UTV's. That is just the pure science of it.
However, you are all welcome to your own opinions and I am not going get into a long drawn out argument on it. Wish it was different, but I respect the landowner and am grateful to them for allowing any type of trail to be used on their land. They have absolutely nothing to gain by allowing it to happen, so I consider it a very generous gesture.
-John
John, I'm not gonna argue or debate it either, it's thier land.
I would think with the bike being lighter by probly half, that the footprint psi would actualy be less then a atv but it doesn't matter if that's what the land owners want.
Also agree it's very generous of the land owners to allow any trail.
Thanks for the reply's.
nytro
Many times I have met dirt bikes on the local trails and those bikes were traveling a very high speeds, racing actually. Once we had two bikes go past our group without slowing and were going so fast that we were hit by flying stones from the rear tires as they accelerated past us. It was a near head on with the front ATV and a blind curve.
So in as much as the foot print is smaller, the speed is greater and thus the damage caused can be greater. That's my opinion from experience. Also, noise is a big factor with dirt bikes, many run very loud exhaust and remove the spark arrestors. CFR's worry about fires.
So in as much as the foot print is smaller, the speed is greater and thus the damage caused can be greater. That's my opinion from experience. Also, noise is a big factor with dirt bikes, many run very loud exhaust and remove the spark arrestors. CFR's worry about fires.
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Dirt bikes have the same engines that they put in the 4-wheelers. Same HP, half the weight, and not even half the foot print. With a careless rider a dirt bike can do a good amount of damage just accelerating.
I'm not saying I approve or disapprove but I can see their point. What do agree on is that once again a few bad apples have ruined it for everyone.
I'm not saying I approve or disapprove but I can see their point. What do agree on is that once again a few bad apples have ruined it for everyone.
When I go on a long trail ride where I have not been before, then trying to find my way back on same trail, Ive had it happen where I can hardly find my tracks from the way in. All the trails I see where atv's are abundent and the trail does not get groomed weekly, they develope huge ruts, which make it tricky for dirtbikes to manuever. Ive put on thousands of trail miles on my dirtbike in the Western UP and also certain spots (where they allow) in Wisc. I know first hand what the difference is between machine damage. The fact of the matter is most people have four wheelers these days and some people just dont want to consider allowing dirtbikes on there trails. Dont get me wrong I think four wheelers are a blast but I will always have my dirtbike. Its simple its cheap and its fun. Trail bikes have been around long before wheelers. If there worried about land damage the KATV club will be busy.
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