One Man's Trash

[skiroule]

Is usually another man’s trash but I think there are exceptions.

Consulted with my primary sources of bad influence (Snoluver1 and Grub) and they “convinced” me I should pull the trigger on this beauty and I’m pretty jacked about it.
She’s in need of a little polish but from everything I’ve seen and heard, it’s a pretty rare sled that was available as a dealer order only. The seller said he had only seen one other like it and he is a hard-core Chaparral guy. Lots of differences between this sled and the standard Firebird SS models: Special paint/graphics, Thunderbird hood, secondary fuel tank, electric start, tach, and last but not least, a beastly 650 Hirth axial fan motor.

It’s going to be hard not to make this a project for this year. Would be a new challenge but I think I have enough spare parts to bring er’ back. Will never look as good as the one in the Bobby Unser promo shot but could still be a pretty cool sled. Guess we’ll see what develops during the off-season.

 

[Deleted member 10829]

I look forward to following this when you get to it. You need to make room in the garage and sell one of those TX's!

 

[gary_in_neenah]

Gently used, right?
And no mention of the year, any ideas? I'm going to guess 73 or 74 due to the shocks on the skis.
I haven't seen a dual exhaust like that either. Very unique, good luck Kelly and keep us current on things.

 

[jd]

Looks like a fun and great project!

Can't wait to see it when its done.

Gonna have Adam put a turbo in it?

-John

 

[snoluver1]

This is a really neat piece of snowmobile history! It couldn't have ended up in better hands to be preserved as it should! Pretty excited to see how this turns out.

Turbo or super charger......whatever it takes!

 

[skiroule]

You need to make room in the garage and sell one of those TX's!

I definitely need room and am thinking about having to sell a couple of sleds this summer but doubt if it will be the TX's. You'll have dibs if they ever go though.

And no mention of the year, any ideas? I'm going to guess 73 or 74 due to the shocks on the skis.
I haven't seen a dual exhaust like that either. Very unique, good luck Kelly and keep us current on things.

Whoops, omitted that detail. It's a 72, which is my favorite year for this sled. The 73 and later SS models were considerably more "refined" in appearance. The open hood scoop went away and the engine was enclosed in a console, thus depriving the rider of the experience of having their mid-section bathed in carb back-blow. I've only seen the twin Donaldson mufflers on the 72 SS models and i think they might be unique to that year. One of the great things about these sleds is the sound of those twin mufflers.

Gonna have Adam put a turbo in it?
-John

I know he's itching to have a hand in how this engine performs. The Hirth guys say it's not very hard to push this engine up to around 100 hp. Throw a turbo on and factor in a sled that is probably right around 300 lbs, now that would be a handful, considering the handling, track, and suspension. Maybe a grass dragger?

 

[snocrazy]

650cc in a 300 lb sled! Wow I bet that thing is faster than it should be. I have been shopping around looking to get a faster relic. The 72 johnson 35 is not fast enough.
Love that old unser picture. Nice find. How much that bad boy cost yah?

 

[skiroule]

How much that bad boy cost yah?

This question has come up at home but I don't recall "bad boy" ever being part of the question. I do think the term included "piece." To justify the wisdom of my purchases to the home front I've adopted the strategy of following my confession on the price with "but this is what it is really worth." I'm pretty sure this strategy is totally unsuccessful.

The actual price on this sled is a little hard to nail down because the deal included quite a few extras: a couple of hoods, second chassis, good spare track, and some other goodies. Given this, I figure I probably paid in the area of five hundred for the sled itself. Maybe a little high but these don't come along every day.

Any thoughts on a faster relic of your choice? Still quite a few mid 70's - early 80's sleds out there that are light, fun to ride, fairly quick, and have decent parts availability.

 

[sweeperguy]

This question has come up at home but I don't recall "bad boy" ever being part of the question. I do think the term included "piece." To justify the wisdom of my purchases to the home front I've adopted the strategy of following my confession on the price with "but this is what it is really worth." I'm pretty sure this strategy is totally unsuccessful.

The actual price on this sled is a little hard to nail down because the deal included quite a few extras: a couple of hoods, second chassis, good spare track, and some other goodies. Given this, I figure I probably paid in the area of five hundred for the sled itself. Maybe a little high but these don't come along every day.

Any thoughts on a faster relic of your choice? Still quite a few mid 70's - early 80's sleds out there that are light, fun to ride, fairly quick, and have decent parts availability.

One of the sleds I'm looking for, a mistake? (Possibly) [IN ANOTHER THREAD, SKIROULE TRIED WARNING ME ABOUT BUYING VINTAGE SLEDS]
Is a '69 Panther with a 634 Hirth. My Dad had one. The motor on it had been built to run in the I-500 in the Soo. STUPID FAST. I was younger then but remember hanging on for dear life out on the lake.

 

[kirk600]

Wow you sure know how to find some neat old sleds Kelly. I can only dream of adding to my collection as we dont have any more room. Everything keeps multiplying, extra motors, hoods, seats, spindles, carbs, pipes etc. etc. next thing you know you can't fit between the sleds to work on them...looking forward to the build on this Chaparral, I'm sure it is going to be fun when you finally get started.

 

[skiroule]

Believe me Kirk, I can relate to the space issue. It's still my hope that I can build a second garage this summer (slab is already poured). If it doesn't get done, I'm in trouble on so many different fronts.

After walking by the Chap several times a day for the last couple of weeks I finally couldn't take it anymore. I had to get my hands a little dirty just to make me feel better. Stripped most of the stuff off the top to get at the engine. Most things came apart relatively easily but the exhaust will be a challenge - sort of like trying to take the exhaust apart on a 45 year old car without damaging the pipes.

Now I can easily get at the flywheel to see if I can get it off and figure out the spark issue. Would like to see if I could get the engine to fire before I pull it out completely. If the engine shows signs of life, I think it would give me the incentive to try to get the sled back on the snow next winter.

In the photo you can see where the factory had to trim the fan shroud to clear the dash support frame. Guess it was a little hands-on engineering at that point.

 

[snoluver1]

Most things came apart relatively easily but the exhaust will be a challenge - sort of like trying to take the exhaust apart on a 45 year old car without damaging the pipes.

Those flex pipes will definitely be a challenge to seperate. What type of connection is the header pipe to engine? Bolt on flange or threaded?

Not sure the availability of those stainless flex pipes, but we deal with several companies that make us custom built exhaust pieces for work. I may be able to help if you end up in trouble?

 

[skiroule]

Those flex pipes will definitely be a challenge to seperate. What type of connection is the header pipe to enginge? Bolt on flange or threaded?

Not sure the availability of those stainless flex pipes, but we deal with several companies that make us custom built exhaust pieces for work. I may be able to help if you end up in trouble?

I'll give it the old college try but I may end up sacrificing the flex pipes to save the mufflers and header pipes. It's a little hard to see in there with the engine cooling cover on but I'm 99.9% sure the header pipes are flanges with allen bolts (good).

I've seen a lot of stainless flex pipe on trucks but I guess the trick is to find some small enough for the sled. Based on my crude measurement it looks like the flex pipes are approximately 2 1/8" I.D.

I've already run into a couple of things where your skill and connections could be real handy. Now, I just have to come up with a compensation package - maybe a case of Widow Maker Black?

 

[snoluver1]

I'll give it the old college try but I may end up sacrificing the flex pipes to save the mufflers and header pipes. It's a little hard to see in there with the engine cooling cover on but I'm 99.9% sure the header pipes are flanges with allen bolts (good).

I've seen a lot of stainless flex pipe on trucks but I guess the trick is to find some small enough for the sled. Based on my crude measurement it looks like the flex pipes are approximately 2 1/8" I.D.

I've already run into a couple of things where your skill and connections could be real handy. Now, I just have to come up with a compensation package - maybe a case of Widow Maker Black?

You know the score Mr. Skiroule....will work for beer!

One thought I had was you could try heating the pipes up just below the flex pipe connections. Get them chery red and let the heat travel. If you can get the pipe to swell inside the flex, and then allow it to cool completely, you might get lucky enough to expand the flex where it was crimped by the exhaust clamp. I hope I explained that in a way that makes sense?

The other thought I had, and the reason I was asking about the flange, was to not mess with them at all. Just leave them connected to the motor, take the mounts lose and slide the whole motor back with the pipes still attatched. Then, if you can get the shroud lose enough to get a wrench in there, just take off the pipes as an assembly. Mask off the stainless and paint them up still assembled. Might be a bit of messing around?

If all else fales, I'm sure we could come up with something for replacements. I was in the shop this afternoon and just happened to glance over at our scrap pile. Something caught my eye!

Obviously these are much bigger than you need, but it gives some hope that we could possibly find you a similar material, in the correct size, if it came down to it.

 

[chords]

Yep you got a project. A little history - I looked up in an old mag that list some detail for all mfgs sleds in Fall of 1971. It had a MSRP of $1,334.
So you got it for less than half price.

 

[skiroule]

Thinking that getting it for less than half-price is a fair deal for a “gently used" sled (as Gary put it).

I also thought that heat might be worth a try on the exhaust after I get the pipes disconnected from the engine and out of the sled. In the end, I’m determined to not let these pipes win the battle. Too bad those pipes in the photo are just a little too large.

Sometimes a person stumbles across things by sheer dumb luck. Wound up getting some intake adapters from a guy in NY after I asked him about a dual carb setup on a Chaparral he was selling. Turned out he had an extra set these which can be used to convert a 650 Hirth from a single carb to dual carbs.

Don’t know if I will use them yet but what could possibly go wrong if I decided to beef the HP up a little?

 

[old abe]

A friend of mine, his father and uncle had Chap's. I always thought they were really neat looking!!! Enjoy your project, and good luck!!!

 

[frnash]

A friend of mine, his father and uncle had Chap's. I always thought they were really neat looking!!! Enjoy your project, and good luck!!!

Who is Chap, and what did the two of them have of "Chap's"? ('Cuz "Chap's" is a possessive form, ya know.)

 

[skiroule]

A friend of mine, his father and uncle had Chap's. I always thought they were really neat looking!!! Enjoy your project, and good luck!!!

Thanks! It definitely will be a challenge, success is not guaranteed.

Yep, the Chap’s were pretty cool sleds back in the day (sorry Frank, it just looks better with a ‘). In some ways, they were ahead of their time but not every idea they came up with was a success – like the 73 slide rail design. I’m told that the 74 SSX liquid cooled sled was a great all-around sled but by then the writing was on the wall for Chaparral sled production. Their run was pretty short but there is still a small, but rabid following for all the Chaparral sled models.

On the mechanical front, if anyone is looking for a good flywheel puller, this unit from SLP worked really well for me. Very beefy, pulled the 45 year old flywheel without breaking a sweat.

 

[G]

If you can get the pipe/muffler assembly loose from the motor it just about looks like it will fit in a five gallon bucket with the mufflers sticking out on top. Fill the bucket full of favorite solvent or liquid wench swill and leave it alone for about 3 months. Right now it thinks it is all one piece. Try to make it remember it should come apart. I am very much afraid you would wreck those stainless flexes if you just started heating. First soak then heat later. That early Team driven looks like it held up pretty well.