This post is the biggest problem the sport faces. If you open a sled and ride at all you should not wait till the snow flys before you think about riding. Who do you think puts up all the signs? Maybe then ones who do the work should wait till it snows before putting in trails. Then listen to people like you bitch and moan! The purpose of this is to try to increase memberships and hopefully workers on the trails. You point you will try to make will be useless anyway. Cause those same people who wait till it snows will not register their sled still it snows anyway. So if it does not snow the state won't get registration money either.
POLL. In marginal snow areas, when will you buy your WIDNR trail permit?
- Thread starter snobuilder
- Start date
snobuilder
Well-known member
Biggest problem?....LOL...sorry this thread upset you.
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100% agreed. One of the trail passes' purposes was to try to increase club membership to help with volunteer work. Or at least make it aware that more help is needed.
You forgot to include - buy one every year ahead of time like ridindirty800 stated. You stated this is for people
concerning those who probably don't think much about the sled(s) they have til the snow falls. Only if all the hardworking club members waited till snowfall to mark trails, brush trails, get landowner permission, groomer maintenance, host club fundraisers. To add onto renegade's post.
If we only knew how the snow would be for year. It would be easy to pass on the above work, or to buy a trail pass. We don't, so we have to unite together to get the work done. Or just maybe considering buying a trail pass....
snobuilder
Well-known member
The fringe riders that pony up the full $30/$50 trail permit fee contribute 3/5 times as much directly into the state trail fund as those who join a club for the discount.
Vast majority of new members did it for the discount ONLY...lining up for a discount is human nature.
Vast majority of new members did it for the discount ONLY...lining up for a discount is human nature.
I think what SB is getting at is the AWSC stated WI had 100,000 less registrations and trail permits last year due to low snow no snow conditions in WI. AWSC thinks Riders will pony up online when and where the snowfalls. IDK the shrinking numbers concern me big time much like the baseball strike peeps move on to other things and don't come back. Imo it will be difficult to keep trails going south of Wausau without widespread snow in southern WI. Maintaining trails is a huge task year round and with limited use it will be difficult to maintain rider interest in snowmobiling thru out WI.
snobuilder
Well-known member
Wasn't aware of any stats like that WD. I think the DNR would report those numbers, no?...Besides.....registration and trail permit numbers wouldn't necessarily go hand in hand.
Weather wouldn't be a factor for re-registrations either as they are done in summer.
As far as getting a discount permit through the AWSC this time of year, our club is about done taking members and we don't have the time or reason to cater to anyone waiting last minute to join our club for a lousy discount.
That is why I framed the question to them who would wait for snow and then pay the full trail permit fee directly to the DNR.
BTW it costs each club $1.50 per AWSC online membership transaction whether it is one new member or 100.
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I joined the club closest to the area that I ride in the most (Minocqua area) but do not have the ability to come up and help with work.
i don't do it for a discount but was hoping that the money they can keep and the extra I donate would benefit the club directly. In a perfect world I could do some work but that's just not reality in my life right now.
i don't do it for a discount but was hoping that the money they can keep and the extra I donate would benefit the club directly. In a perfect world I could do some work but that's just not reality in my life right now.
dito for me in MN- airport got 32" last year 54" average -we are south of there, my MN tabs are 6 years expired but my MI trail sticker says 2018!
POLARISDAN
New member
would happily pay the 50 bucks at a site..dont have the time to deal with the bs..normally dont matter but this year wanted to ride to PI since they finally got snow..what a hassle
snobuilder
Well-known member
Not sure what you mean by BS? Is it more difficult to get a WI trail permit than lets say a MI trail permit?
Are you sure this is what the sign said? The DNR does sell the permits. But you can't get the discounted permits from them. The problem most people complain about is the DNR des not print stickers anymore. They have outsourced all sticker printing. Any registration or trail pass sticker is sent to an outside company for printing and they send the sticker. So if the sign actually said they do not sell trail permits, they flat out lied, and the outsourcing of sticking printing has made the process "wacked". You trailer to MI to ride. Yet nobody is complaining you need a sticker there? The problem here is the DNR.
snobuilder
Well-known member
The very nature of snowmobiling dictates that you be ready to ride when the op is here....a day, a weekend, a month...no one knows... The whole idea of an extra step(trail permit sticker) to be able to do so is counter productive to the entire process....kill bill.
Then why don't you complain about that extra step in Michigan? If you are a procrastinator thats what you will do. Just get the permit at the beginning of the year. No problems. If you really want to address the problem and fix it, complain to the DNR. Cause I have news for you, if cap step never happened, out of staters would still not get a sticker the day they showed up to ride, and the procrastinators would not get a sticker when they went to the DNR office to renew. Nothing to do with any bill. It was DNR cutting costs and outsourcing sticker printing. Pick up the phone call them and ask if you don't believe me.
POLARISDAN
New member
yes..i can buy it at the gas station on my way in..and i want a sticker not a piece of paper
i dont even have an address that i know of to send it to in mass..just a hassle
This has been my point. Its not the fact you need a trail permit, but the fact DNR has quit printing the stickers themselves is the hassle. I doubt anybody would have foresaw them doing this. I'm guessing they are playing dirty trying to blame politicians for funding cuts or whatever.
snobuilder
Well-known member
I would think the supporters and framers of Cap Step are responsible for the smooth transition from one system to another. What seems to have happened is the AWSC got their wish and then gave up on any sort of reasonable permit distribution plan. And YES that would have meant the legislation would REQUIRE the AWSC and DNR develop a seamless, quick, and hassle free way to get these permits in the end users hands. All they had to do was look across the border in MI to see a working system.
Of course maybe the DNR saw the handwriting on the wall and they would have wanted to alternately kept everything as easy as before with a simple hike in registration fees to fund our trails.
Lots of sour grapes on the part of the DNR and also finger pointing by the now complacent AWSC.....very childish.
Shortly after cap step started we were already told how great it was working and trail funding is way up.... if this is true, I would think these funds could be used to set up an onsite printing system without it coming from the DNR budget.
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I got back involved with our local club this year, and volunteered to be the secretary/AWSC membership handler. It's a bit of a pain in the ***. Renewing members online is pretty simple of course, but then the AWSC sends members renewal cards to me (they don't send to the individual) and then I'm supposed to mail out the renewal cards. The whole thing seems kinda clumsy.
I don't know if this system is boosting club membership, but I'm sure it's not boosting club involvement. And, the revenue a club gets from membership is minimal compared to reimbursement from trail maintenance.
I don't know if this system is boosting club membership, but I'm sure it's not boosting club involvement. And, the revenue a club gets from membership is minimal compared to reimbursement from trail maintenance.
snobuilder
Well-known member
yes, the club membership chair now does the most work on the board.Our guy brought the little cards to the meeting if someone wants theirs.....otherwise your membership number stays the same every year and is on your WSN magazine label.
We have a boost in club membership and get more involvement 3 time a season....so far......when trails go in, trails come out and the Xmas party....in other words, when free drinks and food are on the line....LOL
Well I for one am not going to blame the AWSC for not adding to the legislation that a system that has been in place for years remain in place. Mainly cause I didn't think that would happen, so how can I point a finger and say "you should have known."
Cap step is trying to solve TWO problems. Money shortage and volunteer shortage. In my opinion I will not call it successful unless I see an increase in active club memebers throughout the state. We could have just simply raised registration, but would good does more money do if no one puts in the trails?
There is more money. Trail maintenace per mile has been inreased. You should know this from your club. I will find out if the AWSC is coming up with ideas to get stickers back over the counter. I'm sure it will take money to get it done. And I'm sure it won't be overnight. So for now, just order five days in advance. Thats all it takes.