Turn Out the Lights, Wisconsin

[wiviperman]

I work for a major Building Materials Manufacturer in S.E. Wisconsin and we are deemed essential. I was presented a document paper from my employer stating where I work and that I need to keep a current paystub with me in my vehicle for when I am traveling to and from work to show proof to law enforcement.
Definitely seems strange that there are these limitations, almost feels like being violated to a certain degree.
However, I'm glad to be working, my wife was not so fortunate along with so many others that were laid off. I just hope all of us can come out of the other side of this without being in financial ruins!

 

[Skylar]

Bergstrom in the Fox Cities shut it ALL down and their presence is a small city in itself. Not sure what is going on with your dealer? Nobody buying cars while working from home and keeping 6 foot distance.

Zimbrick shut down for two weeks, 950 people.

 

[xcr440]

So what happens when they lift the restrictions, did the virus suddenly die? Disappear? Go away? This will never end if they keep going - this is NOT a sustainable model to continue living under.

I'm sorry to say this to people who are scared and at risk, but most of the experts say 60-70% of us will get it eventually. If we go on the current plan, that would take YEARS to work this through our communities. NO WAY can we sustain a functioning society like this.

 

[chunk06]

So what happens when they lift the restrictions, did the virus suddenly die? Disappear? Go away? This will never end if they keep going - this is NOT a sustainable model to continue living under.

I'm sorry to say this to people who are scared and at risk, but most of the experts say 60-70% of us will get it eventually. If we go on the current plan, that would take YEARS to work this through our communities. NO WAY can we sustain a functioning society like this.

They are trying to figure out the fine line between completely destroying the economy and people getting sick. of course Trump is getting flak over this. I could not imagine being part of a decision like that. All I know is that I hate the media even more than I did with what is going on

 

[DamageInc]

So what happens when they lift the restrictions, did the virus suddenly die? Disappear? Go away? This will never end if they keep going - this is NOT a sustainable model to continue living under.

I'm sorry to say this to people who are scared and at risk, but most of the experts say 60-70% of us will get it eventually. If we go on the current plan, that would take YEARS to work this through our communities. NO WAY can we sustain a functioning society like this.

Really only two possibilities: One: they develop an effective vaccine and the virus is essentially eliminated.

Two: it becomes endemic, and makes a return every fall/winter, just as the flu does. Numbers drop as we develop some herd immunity, but it's still around.

 

[xcr440]

Really only two possibilities: One: they develop an effective vaccine and the virus is essentially eliminated.

Two: it becomes endemic, and makes a return every fall/winter, just as the flu does. Numbers drop as we develop some herd immunity, but it's still around.

My points exactly. Any effective vaccine will take YEARS to develop. And being a virus, your option two is the most likely scenario. Are we going to shut the country down every year for months at a time? It won't be sustainable.

 

[euphoric1]

So what happens when they lift the restrictions, did the virus suddenly die? Disappear? Go away? This will never end if they keep going - this is NOT a sustainable model to continue living under.

I'm sorry to say this to people who are scared and at risk, but most of the experts say 60-70% of us will get it eventually. If we go on the current plan, that would take YEARS to work this through our communities. NO WAY can we sustain a functioning society like this.

AGREED X100, if people honestly think the number of infected will be magically less when april 24th? I have news for everyone! Then what do we do? continue to kill the economy? put people out of work and their livelihood? WE CANT DO THIS!!! the fact of the matter is the number of infected numbers is GROSSLY understated and they admitted that the projected mortality rate was way over estimated.

 

[dfattack]

I have said this before, the numbers are now lower than the regular annual flu. Yes, over time the stats (deaths, number infected, etc) may look similar when it's all said and done. I think the big question, which the last few posts are discussing but only in the context of the corona virus is if this is the new normal reaction/plan to virus' and disease that arrive on our shores in the future. Are we going to shut down the entire country every time a disease or Virus comes to our country? Again, based on the stats comparing the regular flu vs the corona virus or even the next virus that comes from the markets in China or the jungles of Africa they are very similar. Why are we reacting this way now but not for the flu which we see every year? it seems like so many people are missing that correlation on TV. I personally don't get it. I'm not a doctor, scientist or anyone educated in the field necessary to understand disease or how it works but I don't understand what is so different about this one versus the flu or SARS, ebola, etc.

I'm also seeing the divide that we all see every day in our country regarding politics happening with the reaction to the corona virus. Some have no problem shutting everything down "for the good of the people". I get it. But I don't see how we can't chew gum and walk at the same time. Now I'm rambling so I'm done. Still frustrated though

 

[sweeperguy]

I have said this before, the numbers are now lower than the regular annual flu. Yes, over time the stats (deaths, number infected, etc) may look similar when it's all said and done. I think the big question, which the last few posts are discussing but only in the context of the corona virus is if this is the new normal reaction/plan to virus' and disease that arrive on our shores in the future. Are we going to shut down the entire country every time a disease or Virus comes to our country? Again, based on the stats comparing the regular flu vs the corona virus or even the next virus that comes from the markets in China or the jungles of Africa they are very similar. Why are we reacting this way now but not for the flu which we see every year? it seems like so many people are missing that correlation on TV. I personally don't get it. I'm not a doctor, scientist or anyone educated in the field necessary to understand disease or how it works but I don't understand what is so different about this one versus the flu or SARS, ebola, etc.

I'm also seeing the divide that we all see every day in our country regarding politics happening with the reaction to the corona virus. Some have no problem shutting everything down "for the good of the people". I get it. But I don't see how we can't chew gum and walk at the same time. Now I'm rambling so I'm done. Still frustrated though

Its how contagious it is. Look at NYC being that they are packed in like sardines has their numbers going through the roof.
I don't necessarily believe everything I see on the news. But it seems to me they've been pretty clear on the reason (much more contagious) this is different than the influenza we are used to.

 

[dfattack]

Its how contagious it is. Look at NYC being that they are packed in like sardines has their numbers going through the roof.
I don't necessarily believe everything I see on the news. But it seems to me they've been pretty clear on the reason (much more contagious) this is different than the influenza we are used to.

Yes, I have seen that comment on TV, but is it really more contagious than Ebola, SARS, H1N1 or even the common flu? I would be interested to see a comparison between the flu with corona virus. It looks like the flu is very contagious too. My point is...is there a point of contagiousness that we shut down the country? if so, what is it. We (citizens) have to be careful allowing our elected officials from making this response normal. If you give a politician and inch they take a foot and never give it back.

 

[Admin]

I have said this before, the numbers are now lower than the regular annual flu. Yes, over time the stats (deaths, number infected, etc) may look similar when it's all said and done. I think the big question, which the last few posts are discussing but only in the context of the corona virus is if this is the new normal reaction/plan to virus' and disease that arrive on our shores in the future. Are we going to shut down the entire country every time a disease or Virus comes to our country? Again, based on the stats comparing the regular flu vs the corona virus or even the next virus that comes from the markets in China or the jungles of Africa they are very similar. Why are we reacting this way now but not for the flu which we see every year? it seems like so many people are missing that correlation on TV. I personally don't get it. I'm not a doctor, scientist or anyone educated in the field necessary to understand disease or how it works but I don't understand what is so different about this one versus the flu or SARS, ebola, etc.

I'm also seeing the divide that we all see every day in our country regarding politics happening with the reaction to the corona virus. Some have no problem shutting everything down "for the good of the people". I get it. But I don't see how we can't chew gum and walk at the same time. Now I'm rambling so I'm done. Still frustrated though

I continue to sit in the arena of "Not enough information to say if this was overkill or not". We actually may never know the true answer to that or perhaps folks will just hold onto their opinions no matter the outcome.

As for why we are reacting this way... I am just taking a stab at it here, but I feel ALL the details of this bug have not been made available to the general public. The reason I suspect is to now cause a full-scale breakdown in our society (look what happened when folks thought there would be a shortage of TP for cripes sake!) Step back from the situation for a minute and ask yourself: "Why in the world would just about all of the ENTIRE WORLD react in a similar manner?" The planet does go through the seasonal flu every year. It has also gone through other outbreaks like MERS, SARS, Ebola, etc. The only rational answer is that the general public just does not know all the facts on this. It is clear it is more contagious that the seasonal flu and does have a mortality rate higher than the seasonal flu and SARS (just how much higher is not completely known yet).

Once all the dust settles, many of the questions should be able to be seen. Perhaps some mysteries will remain.

The reason why just about the entire world has gone on lockdown or will be is that is has proven to dramatically slow the spread. Thus the debate of is the price paid OK, or too high? My answer is: check with me later!

-John

 

[Admin]

Yes, I have seen that comment on TV, but is it really more contagious than Ebola, SARS, H1N1 or even the common flu?

Here is a nice graph showing the spread of this virus vs. SARS and MERS. Keep in mind, this graph was made on Feb 8th. Pretty much the time when it was business as usual in all but China, with 37,500 cases. Today there are 372,757 cases with 16,200 deaths.

 

[xcr440]

The reason why just about the entire world has gone on lockdown or will be is that is has proven to dramatically slow the spread. Thus the debate of is the price paid OK, or too high? My answer is: check with me later!

-John

Agreed - we are in this neck deep now, there is no turning back from it at this point. They are collecting A LOT of data if you believe the talking heads, hopefully those numbers start to bear real indications of how the lock down has worked.

 

[dfattack]

I continue to sit in the arena of "Not enough information to say if this was overkill or not". We actually may never know the true answer to that or perhaps folks will just hold onto their opinions no matter the outcome.

As for why we are reacting this way... I am just taking a stab at it here, but I feel ALL the details of this bug have not been made available to the general public. The reason I suspect is to now cause a full-scale breakdown in our society (look what happened when folks thought there would be a shortage of TP for cripes sake!) Step back from the situation for a minute and ask yourself: "Why in the world would just about all of the ENTIRE WORLD react in a similar manner?" The planet does go through the seasonal flu every year. It has also gone through other outbreaks like MERS, SARS, Ebola, etc. The only rational answer is that the general public just does not know all the facts on this. It is clear it is more contagious that the seasonal flu and does have a mortality rate higher than the seasonal flu and SARS (just how much higher is not completely known yet).

Once all the dust settles, many of the questions should be able to be seen. Perhaps some mysteries will remain.

The reason why just about the entire world has gone on lockdown or will be is that is has proven to dramatically slow the spread. Thus the debate of is the price paid OK, or too high? My answer is: check with me later!

-John

responding to the bold text...I agree with that, but if true do you think that will remain hidden for long. There would be a lot of people in the loop not releasing all the information. If your statement ends up being true then I would completely understand our reaction. I have a problem with politicians having too much power to shut down our economy and livelihoods in a matter of days and the point I'm trying to make is we (citizens) need to have a way to not allow this to happen again if it wasn't justified.

 

[dfattack]

Here is a nice graph showing the spread of this virus vs. SARS and MERS. Keep in mind, this graph was made on Feb 8th. Pretty much the time when it was business as usual in all but China, with 37,500 cases. Today there are 372,757 cases with 16,200 deaths.

View attachment 61444

Interesting. Maybe we should be seeing more information like that in the press conferences to help us understand more.

 

[Highflyer]

buy backs increase stock price. If stock sold then they would pay the taxes. So no your not right

I was implying they would pay taxes on the cash at the end of the year (tax return) if they didn't go the stock buyback route.

 

[Highflyer]

Yes, I have seen that comment on TV, but is it really more contagious than Ebola, SARS, H1N1 or even the common flu? I would be interested to see a comparison between the flu with corona virus. It looks like the flu is very contagious too. My point is...is there a point of contagiousness that we shut down the country? if so, what is it. We (citizens) have to be careful allowing our elected officials from making this response normal. If you give a politician and inch they take a foot and never give it back.

I think the shut down was more to give the hospitals time to get ready (more PPE, ventailater, possible drugs that work on the virus) then a reflection of this virus being significantly worse then those others listed. Also the fact that this virus seems to attach to your lungs making it hard to breathe. Hence why people with additional health issues are having the hardest time with this virus.

 

[Admin]

responding to the bold text...I agree with that, but if true do you think that will remain hidden for long. There would be a lot of people in the loop not releasing all the information. If your statement ends up being true then I would completely understand our reaction. I have a problem with politicians having too much power to shut down our economy and livelihoods in a matter of days and the point I'm trying to make is we (citizens) need to have a way to not allow this to happen again if it wasn't justified.

If the bold text were true, then I don't believe it would remain hidden for too long, unless somehow made classified, then that would make leaking it a pretty serious deal to the person that did. Probably more serious than the minute of fame they they would get by leaking it. Again, this was just a stab in the dark. Perhaps there is not hidden info, just more things like the graph I posted. When added up, would cause such sever actions to be found necessary by our government and others around the world.

I too fear that things of this nature could be used as a political weapon, but I also have faith that the majority of the voting population is intelligent to see through such crap and only the far rights and far lefts believe the stupid stuff put out by the media.

I also believe we just need to look to China and Italy to see how things will progress as far as getting back to normal. We may not follow them step for step because the effects of the virus on our country will likely be different than theirs, but it will give a good indication. So far the lockdowns in those two countries have seemed to have very positive effects. Hopefully it will work for us too and in a few weeks, things will gradually be put back on line.

-John

 

[DamageInc]

I continue to sit in the arena of "Not enough information to say if this was overkill or not". We actually may never know the true answer to that or perhaps folks will just hold onto their opinions no matter the outcome.

As for why we are reacting this way... I am just taking a stab at it here, but I feel ALL the details of this bug have not been made available to the general public. The reason I suspect is to now cause a full-scale breakdown in our society (look what happened when folks thought there would be a shortage of TP for cripes sake!) Step back from the situation for a minute and ask yourself: "Why in the world would just about all of the ENTIRE WORLD react in a similar manner?" The planet does go through the seasonal flu every year. It has also gone through other outbreaks like MERS, SARS, Ebola, etc. The only rational answer is that the general public just does not know all the facts on this. It is clear it is more contagious that the seasonal flu and does have a mortality rate higher than the seasonal flu and SARS (just how much higher is not completely known yet).

Once all the dust settles, many of the questions should be able to be seen. Perhaps some mysteries will remain.

The reason why just about the entire world has gone on lockdown or will be is that is has proven to dramatically slow the spread. Thus the debate of is the price paid OK, or too high? My answer is: check with me later!

-John

I agree with most of that, but SARS 1 had a far higher mortality rate than COVID-19 (SARS 2) currently does. It was around 10%. https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/mm5249a2.htm But it certainly didn't seem as transmissible.

I suspect that there is more than one strain going around, and that the virus has already mutated. The Chinese reported diarrhea as a common symptom, and yet if you go to the CDC website, they don't list any digestive issues at all under symptoms. That is very odd.

- - - Updated - - -

Estimates of SARS death rates revised upward









Filed Under: SARS

By: Robert Roos | May 07, 2003



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http://www.cidrap.umn.edu/news-perspective/2003/05/estimates-sars-death-rates-revised-upward

May 7, 2003 (CIDRAP News) – The World Health Organization (WHO) today estimated the overall fatality rate for SARS (severe acute respiratory syndrome) patients at 14% to 15%, significantly higher than previous estimates. The agency estimated the rate for people older than 64 years to be more than 50%.

 

[xcr440]

Here it comes for MN - 2pm press conference, "Shelter in Place"