$10 Fee increase for Michigan Trail Pass next year

[Banks93]

I agree on all your points banks. It has never been my contention that the UP was an economically strong area. My point was that it is a whole lot more diversified than your initial post stated. By what you have said in the subsequent posts, it seems like you agree.

Folks do not move to the UP to get financially rich, they move out for that. Folks move to the UP to richen their lives and leave the big financial worries to the big city folks.

-John

Yes, and it is those folks that I enjoy helping by spending money in there hotels, bars, resorts and restaurants. : )

Here are some numbers. I would love to retire up in the UP or Northern WI woods. I just hope when turn comes to retire that we can still enjoy the great resources the way our parents and grand parents go to enjoy them.


The Upper Peninsula is one of the few regions in the United States that experiences population decline. Although not every county in the Upper Peninsula has a declining population, this phenomenon does have a significant impact on the social and economic aspects of many of its communities and citizens. Some of the contributing factors to the Upper Peninsula's shifts in population are the boom and bust cycles of the timber and mining industries, as well as the severity of its winters.[citation needed] Some areas in the Upper Peninsula are more prone to declining population than others, with the six westernmost counties being the most dramatic, going from a 1920 level of 153,674 people (representing 59% of the total population of the entire Upper Peninsula) to a 2000 census level of 85,378 persons (dropping to 29% of the total Upper Peninsula's population). It is quite common to see abandoned buildings and ruins in this area; there are even a number of ghost towns that are slowly succumbing to the ubiquitous forest.[citation needed]

Generally speaking, the population of the Upper Peninsula grew throughout the 19th Century, and then leveled off and even experienced decline during the 20th Century, as can readily be seen in the tables below. The data for these tables is from the U.S. Census;[29][30] A "↑" indicates an increase in population from the previous census, and a "↓" indicates a decrease in population from the previous census

 

[polarisrider1]

That is true but according to your previous post you would rather not have them come and keep our(MI) trails to yourself.

Oh, like you, I forgot to say just kidding. The point is if your not coming here over a $10 increase that is laim. Snowmobiling is expensive. What price do you out of staters feel is fair? I suspect you will all have different answers.

 

[polarisrider1]

Skylar, there is much more to snowmobiling Michigan than your little sacred section you call home along the Bill Nickels trail. who's going to pay for those trestle bridges when they wear out. Not the locals, thats for sure. They would like to, but they are trying to servive as it is. The $10 is a couple beers less at Parkview or Mosquito? I think not. Sure nobody is happy about any increases in costs. Did you ride your sled less because of gas costs or was it really because of less snow?

 

[Hoosier]

One thing that's been sort of lost in this discussion is that the MSA pushed for the trail permit increases, not the state of Michigan. This proposal was approved a couple years ago and comments were encouraged during the discussion process. I don't remember all the details, but it had to do with increased costs of groomers, rebuilding bridges, etc. Yes, the DNR/State of Michigan gets a cut of the fees to do who knows what with with it; on the other hand a portion of the gas tax is put into the trail system, which seems fair to me. While the funding process is not as transparent as it could be, essentially a very large percentage of the dollars from sled registrations and trail permits go directly into grooming and maintaining the trails. If you look at their numbers, the increase was necessary. Complaints should be addressed to the MSA, they are the ones who could potentially come up with a short-term permit

 

[Banks93]

Oh, like you, I forgot to say just kidding. The point is if your not coming here over a $10 increase that is laim. Snowmobiling is expensive. What price do you out of staters feel is fair? I suspect you will all have different answers.

I would like to see a to see some kind of rated pass. I bought a $35 dollar one this year for two days of riding. We were going to come back for another couple days but I would say I got overcharged. To me it isn't as much about the money as it is about riding and having a great time. I enjoy the UP long mile good riding trips a couple times a year.

I am just saying that I can do that in WI. Like others have stated the cost of hotels, gas, sleds, time off work, eating expenses, and misc expenses gets to be a lot.

If I can do the same thing in WI and save some money we will stay in WI it isn't that I wouldn't rather do it in the UP it is just that it is cheaper in WI. I hope that makes sense.

 

[superski]

Snowmobiling is a recreational sport - we do it to have fun and enjoy the outdoors. The UP usually gets great snow and it's probably the best area in the country to enjoy the sport we love. By the time we purchase all the equipment necessary to snowmobile, book lodging, and travel, the trail pass is just not that big of a deal. I mean if ya can put out the money for everything it takes to begin with the trail pass is like 1 lunch or a round of drinks in the evening. Seems when the price of the pass goes up everyone gets pissed, but when the snow flies the people will still come. Now if it goes up by $50 or $60 it'll probably stop some people from comming for a while, but even then they'll be back if they really want to ride.

 

[Banks93]

Snowmobiling is a recreational sport - we do it to have fun and enjoy the outdoors. The UP usually gets great snow and it's probably the best area in the country to enjoy the sport we love. By the time we purchase all the equipment necessary to snowmobile, book lodging, and travel, the trail pass is just not that big of a deal. I mean if ya can put out the money for everything it takes to begin with the trail pass is like 1 lunch or a round of drinks in the evening. Seems when the price of the pass goes up everyone gets pissed, but when the snow flies the people will still come. Now if it goes up by $50 or $60 it'll probably stop some people from comming for a while, but even then they'll be back if they really want to ride.

I would say you are correct when the UP is the only place that has snow. When WI and MN have good snow conditions people that may have gone to the UP in the past may stay at home and do not go to the UP. I guess that is my point is now with them raising it another $10 this year that maybe this might be the stick that broke the camels back. I know from our travels this winter that a lot of the bar owners and restaurant owners said they were down this year. I know the meltdowns didn't help but even on good weekends it seemed like less people on the trails.

 

[ridindirty800]

Oh, like you, I forgot to say just kidding. The point is if your not coming here over a $10 increase that is laim. Snowmobiling is expensive. What price do you out of staters feel is fair? I suspect you will all have different answers.

You can call me laim thats fine! And I understand they need to pay for trail mantaince as I do plenty of it here in Wi for 2 different clubs! But Ill keep 45 bucks in my pocket and buy a few more rounds for the guys I am riding with when the day is done and stay in Northern Wi. To me the trails in the U.P are no better then the ones in Wi when you find areas to avoid during high traffic times. Its not the 45 bucks to me its the just as simple as for 25 bucks sure lets go to the U.P for a day or 2 ride. At 45 I have no reason to Leave to WI trail system to go into U.P. I will say if the U.P is the only place with snow to ride then I will be paying the 45. This year even with the lack of snow in N. WI i was able to take 4 trips and ride on good conditions on all of them. Also a 5th trip to Central Wi. I think the increase will only have a effect on guys like me who ride up from Wi into michigan or families with a bunch of sleds to buy stickers for. Guys who stay in U.P will prob still go, but I think there will be a lot less of the people who stay from lets say Hurley over to NE WI going up to ride in the U.P

 

[xcr440]

Griping about costs going up is like b*tching about the weather. You can't control it.

 

[xsledder]

Griping about costs going up is like b*tching about the weather. You can't control it.

Actually, I can control the cost of the trail permit. I don't have to go to the UP and buy it.

 

[ridindirty800]

Griping about costs going up is like b*tching about the weather. You can't control it.

You are right! But I can stay in Wi ride great trails and never pay the extra 45. It really doesn't bother the price going up all I am saying is to me ill stay in wi and ride if there is snow rather then include the U.P in part of the ride from Northern Wi.

 

[mjkaliszak]

This thread has grown since this morning. I tried to post but had upload issues. I don't see $10 as much of an issue since I spend money like it is on fire before & during the season. Things could be worse or more expensive for example :

I looked into a trip to NY to visit family & relatives. The state of NY charges a $100 registration fee ( per year ) to ride there, regardless of your origin ( resident - non resident ) per machine. You can get a $35 dollar voucher if you join a club thus lowering the fee to $65. In addition to this if you want to ride an area like Old Forge ( more scenic & has paid groomers ) the trail fee for that area is an additional $85 per machine. With that being said when I estimated some costs just for a 1 time , 6 day trip, 4 days of riding it seemed prohibitive. Just in sled fee's ( X3 = 2 sleds plus the back up sled ) was $450 to be legal or as much as $555 if you didn't join a club.

In MI, 45 X 3 = $135.

I want to say as long as I can support the sport I will and don't really have an issue spending the extra dollars.

If you compare it to launching a boat at a state launch ( $8 per day minimum) it comparitively seems like a bargian .

IMO

PS.... "Truimp for President"......

 

[Skylar]

Skylar, there is much more to snowmobiling Michigan than your little sacred section you call home along the Bill Nickels trail. who's going to pay for those trestle bridges when they wear out. Not the locals, thats for sure. They would like to, but they are trying to servive as it is. The $10 is a couple beers less at Parkview or Mosquito? I think not. Sure nobody is happy about any increases in costs. Did you ride your sled less because of gas costs or was it really because of less snow?

I am sure there is, but, I have no desire to see it. By the way, it's not like I have never snowmobiled anywhere except the Twin Lakes area.

As far as MYSELF paying for a trail permit, I have no issue at all with the increase in price. You have to pay to play. Make it $100, I will pay it with a big fricken smile on my face. But, when someone else says it is not worth it to THEM, to pay the extra cost, I am not going to tell THEM that their opinion is a lame one.

As far as riding my sled less this year, I don't follow. My sled budget for a season is one 3 day trip a month, in the yoop, for Dec-March, and hopefully April. Also, as much riding here at home that snow, and my budget, will allow. Lets see, Dec in da yoop, yep did that, January in da yoop, nope, went to the Snowies instead, Feb in da yoop, yep, did that, March in da yoop, yep did that, riding here at home, yep, close to 500 miles I would say, April in da yoop, probably not going to happen. So as far as the amount of riding I did this year, pretty much on par with other years. Gas costs, yep, up up up, will that stop me from making my regular trips to the yoop, not on your life.

I am not sure you are aware of this, but, not everyone who enjoys snowmobiling, and is passionate about snowmobiling, makes the same amount of money as you. Just becasue you have more money than me, does not mean that my passion for the sport is less than yours. If a guy says he cannot afford to take his family of 4 to Mi for a weekend ride, because that would cost him $180 in trail permits alone, well then so be it. Who are we, as fellow sledheads, to judge others, on their opinion if the cost of the trail permit is not worth it to THEM?

 

[mjkaliszak]

Maybe we have forgotten how fortunate we ALL really are ?

 

[doomsman]

Maybe we have forgotten how fortunate we ALL really are ?

Yes you are right, we drive through states as big as country's
and don't need visas or passports or stop at the borders.

How ever no 3 or 4 day pass is bad, stay in Wi. and ride to Copper 1 day and ride back the next? $45 is a lot

 

[polarisrider1]

Maybe we have forgotten how fortunate we ALL really are ?

True.

 

[polarisrider1]

I am sure there is, but, I have no desire to see it. By the way, it's not like I have never snowmobiled anywhere except the Twin Lakes area.

As far as MYSELF paying for a trail permit, I have no issue at all with the increase in price. You have to pay to play. Make it $100, I will pay it with a big fricken smile on my face. But, when someone else says it is not worth it to THEM, to pay the extra cost, I am not going to tell THEM that their opinion is a lame one.

As far as riding my sled less this year, I don't follow. My sled budget for a season is one 3 day trip a month, in the yoop, for Dec-March, and hopefully April. Also, as much riding here at home that snow, and my budget, will allow. Lets see, Dec in da yoop, yep did that, January in da yoop, nope, went to the Snowies instead, Feb in da yoop, yep, did that, March in da yoop, yep did that, riding here at home, yep, close to 500 miles I would say, April in da yoop, probably not going to happen. So as far as the amount of riding I did this year, pretty much on par with other years. Gas costs, yep, up up up, will that stop me from making my regular trips to the yoop, not on your life.

I am not sure you are aware of this, but, not everyone who enjoys snowmobiling, and is passionate about snowmobiling, makes the same amount of money as you. Just becasue you have more money than me, does not mean that my passion for the sport is less than yours. If a guy says he cannot afford to take his family of 4 to Mi for a weekend ride, because that would cost him $180 in trail permits alone, well then so be it. Who are we, as fellow sledheads, to judge others, on their opinion if the cost of the trail permit is not worth it to THEM?

You have not a clue as to how much or little I make Skylar. It has nothing to do with any of this. The permits will go up and that's that. You are always going the personal route with me. John's response is as acurate as it gets.

 

[snoluver1]

If a guy says he cannot afford to take his family of 4 to Mi for a weekend ride, because that would cost him $180 in trail permits alone, well then so be it. Who are we, as fellow sledheads, to judge others, on their opinion if the cost of the trail permit is not worth it to THEM?

PERIOD, THE END!

Can we go back to ripping on each other, and adding smiley's. That was much more fun.

 

[attack_06]

bottom line when the up is the only one with snow u will pay the 45 and u will like it even if u only go once all year or u just wont ride

 

[xsledder]

bottom line when the up is the only one with snow u will pay the 45 and u will like it even if u only go once all year or u just wont ride

True for some people but not for others. Me personally, I don't foresee a period where the UP will have snow and the mountains in the east or west won't. Therefore I believe there will always be a chance for me to ride in other areas, which are new to me, and not just the UP.

Yes, I will pay the higher fee in the other new areas and stay longer making their permit fee more cost effective. Riding the snow train in Canada and paying their fee would be worth it to me because it is new and different.