Conservation group buying a big chunk of land in the Keweenaw

ICT Sledder

Active member
Saw on one of the Facebook pages that I follow for Keweenaw area news and whatnot that a group by the name of the North Woods Conservancy is fundraising to buy a 546 acre parcel of land around and to include a substantial chunk of the Gratiot River:

http://www.keweenawreport.com/news/...kWOD1lCE8MRFIZWV5hbGesAraymfHfGFfS34mdpsMw8Bw

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This isn't a piece of land that would jeopardize established sled trails, but since this purchase would connect with other parcels owned by conservation groups to effectively form a pretty substantial combined acreage, it could potentially lock out various land users and outdoor enthusiasts from a fairly substantial geographic swath of land, save for one or two "acceptable" uses traditionally allowed by groups like this. I'm not sure if this land as it sits today is accessible for summer ORV trails, or off trail stuff for winter use, but I'm sure some of you can look at the maps in the above link and know.

There's almost zero development demand and profitable use of land in the Keweenaw (which is reflected in the LOL-low $2500/ac sale price here, which even that figure is really high for the peninsula - due to the lake and river frontage) so I'm not sure what imagined threat they see in the either short or long-term; it's basically just about control and a long-view plan. A slow amass of as much land as possible, so that access and use can be dictated forever. Buy one square mile chunks of land (about what this buy is) over enough years, and with strategic geographic linking in mind, and eventually a group can shut down entire trail systems (among other outdoor uses).

I mean most sledders would consider themselves by definition to be land conservationists - meaning we don't want it all turned into subdivisions or solar fields or oil patches or even a bunch of blown out ORV trails overlapping each other every 50 feet - but land conservationists in the traditional sense aren't friendly in any manner towards the way folks like us enjoy our time outdoors. Their end game is a slow restriction of access, starting with the obvious, and then when even foot traffic exceeds their thresholds of acceptability even that will severely be cut back. It's "conservation" such that economic 1%ers in the largest metros in the US, who don't actually spend their recreational time in the outdoors, can sleep well at night so that plebeians like us, who do actually spend out recreational time outdoors, have less and less options.

Not trying to sound too alarmist, but stuff like this is a slow drip in a land access fight outdoor users like us will eventually lose. Death by a thousand cuts.
 
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old abe

Well-known member
Well, "Fore Sale", +$$$$, =Sold??? Not much we can do about it. Hard to tell what this will become, or turn into??? Just think of it this way, many of who snowmobile now days, won't, or don't join a club, and some don't even think to contribute to the "Trail Donation" collections. No matter how many they my pass by. Really a sad situation. I seem to remember grub saying more than once that we are a dying sport. Spot on!!!
 
I would like to own a bunch of land in the UP. Being a sledder I would of course want the trail to continue. Why would I want land? because I want my kids and there kids and there kids.....to enjoy the UP and the outdoors as I have. Everybody has a reason and they may have a reason to buy all this land and it may be to isolate it and keep it to themselves. But that's there thing. I want it because I'm afraid someone else will buy it and deny me access. If all of us sledders assume the current land owners will always own it and always let us borrow the trail space than it won't be around forever. They will die and with it the relationship the sled clubs have built with them dies too.
 

mezz

Well-known member
We've been kept out of that area with ATV & Sleds for quite a few years already, so, not really surprising to me at all. This was when this conservancy group was in their infant stages of formulating. They also took away another popular place to a number of us locals known as "Baldy", actually named "Bald Mountain". Sadly, a few bad apples have started this progress, hopefully, the conservancy can find a way for this to be shared by motorsports enthusiasts as well.-Mezz
 

snoluver1

Active member
Actually sounds like a pretty good business model we could follow. Pool together a bunch of money from like minded people...buy up interconnecting parcels for the sake of presevation of motorized access! Let's get it rolling!!!:friendly_wink:
 

jime

Active member
ICT Sledder

please don't speak for this sledder. to quote "conservationists in the traditional sense aren't friendly in any manner towards the way folks like us enjoy our time outdoors"

"potentially lock out land users". Jeez go buy your own land let us all use it, for our own needs. its so cheap, just buy it and be done with all these people not like us.
 

Sledhead!

Member
I'm with snoluver1, let's all pitch in a buy land. No building allowed, just trails and areas to ride. We can tell everyone else to pound sand:)
 
G

G

Guest
One more thing to consider here. First off I am from MN and this is happening in Mich so I don't know if the rules and laws are the same but I suspect they are. Here in MN we have a thing called The Nature Conservancy. They are buying up land in the western part of our county. It is mostly non-tillable swamp but in the past has been used for cattle. Anyway, once the Nature Conservancy -or the MN DNR - buys the land they no longer have to pay taxes on it. So when enough land gets bought by these entities it starts to effect the local county taxes. It is starting to happen here now. You are just talking about 1 section of land there in Mich but consider if 20 sections all of a sudden contribute nothing to a county's property tax. This is a double edged sword. No longer can the land be accessed and it will end up costing others to make up the lost taxes. It is BS.
 

ICT Sledder

Active member
Any parcel of land that can be argued to have any sort of agricultural use (crops, livestock, timber) already has low property taxes, in most Midwest and/or Great Plains states. Pennies on the dollar (compared to full tax bill) in some cases.

The Nature Conservancy is nationwide. In my state they are very active in persuading ranchers to apply a deed restriction to their land called a conservation easement, that basically locks out all other uses of the land permanently. The land is then only able to be used for cattle grazing and nothing else, ever. Even if it is sold (deed restrictions stay from owner to owner).
 

ICT Sledder

Active member
no, that was meant to be a rhetorical. sorry cannot find the right emoji.

I’m certain you do well offering unsolicited advice on the best steps by which to pick up a turd by it’s clean end, but I’m essentially repeating myself from my prior post in response to you.
 

jime

Active member
Don't put narrow-minded crap out there and you won't get called out. Post on discussion board and call a response unsolicited, what could you expect.
 

ICT Sledder

Active member
Don't put narrow-minded crap out there and you won't get called out. Post on discussion board and call a response unsolicited, what could you expect.

Explain to me then how you would posit that land conservation groups are helping to further the future of snowmobiling (and UTVs, and ATVs, and motorcycles, and mountain bikes, and... similar)? How are they affirming our current access and legal arrangements? How are they helping to add to available acreage/access for such uses? How are they ensuring that the eventuality of trail system closures doesn't become a reality? Why does the ORV PAC Blue Ribbon Coalition even exist, then, if conservation groups do not represent a threat?

Here's your chance to add your well-positioned take on this to the topic, as opposed to deflective ad-hominem-ish nonsense.

I mean I'm basically asking you to give a logical argument as to how the world is flat, but you're welcome to have a go. Otherwise, you quite literally do not have a leg to stand on intellectually, so I'm curious to why you would even throw your hat into this discussion.
 
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snoluver1

Active member
So here's a question for all yoos intellemiggent edjumacated type guys:

Is it conceivably possible to start a "recreational land conservancy"? I know there are already advocacy groups out there fighting for us, but I'm saying a non-profit organization with the sole purpose being to buy land for the conservation of motorized recreation. If A-typical conservation groups can buy it to lock us out, why couldn't we buy it to keep it open?
 

ICT Sledder

Active member
So here's a question for all yoos intellemiggent edjumacated type guys:

Is it conceivably possible to start a "recreational land conservancy"? I know there are already advocacy groups out there fighting for us, but I'm saying a non-profit organization with the sole purpose being to buy land for the conservation of motorized recreation. If A-typical conservation groups can buy it to lock us out, why couldn't we buy it to keep it open?

I don't know 'bout the first sentence there, but absolutely a group of whomever can buy whatever parcel of land they please, and do almost whatever they want within reason. In theory. Insurance liability issues and legal fights with conservationists/enviros could be problematic, in certain instances. The latter has a tendency of tying up whatever ground they see fit in the courts for eternity, regardless of their legal standing in the piece of ground.

If the Keweenaw sled club bought this very parcel of land at hand and created some sort of ORV trail system within it, I would bet good money the conservationists/enviros would simply shake a pretty pile of money in front of whatever scientist or professor is currently lacking in grant funding, and a study would be completed posthaste and from whole cloth inventing an environmental catastrophe that would be caused by this trail system. It's just their strategic MO; how they fight.

But yeah, big picture I'm surprised with the sheer numbers and average household incomes of the highly-organized snowmobile community, more hasn't been done in this respect. Say a figure of $500 or $1000 was donated from every sledding individual or family in this country, a HUGE warchest would be created, but only so much can be done, even with willing money. I believe in the Keweenaw specifically the vast majority of the land we ride on is owned by a huge timber conglomerate (locals like JD would know the name of the company), then some public land, and then a scattering of small parcel private land owners. Think that is the case with a lot of the upper midwest riding areas. So the limitation really isn't money, but the availability of big chunks of contiguous ground.
 
G

G

Guest
As it is right now they are much better organized and they have A LOT OF MONEY. Another way they can grab land is to discover some rare grass variety or endangered bird or nesting area. That has already happened here. The most disturbing thing about them is they seek control of the land and its use long into the future. Efforts at our level should involve keeping what we have. My 2 cents anyway.
 

Skylar

Super Moderator
Staff member
When i win the lottery, and i will dang it, my goal is to buy every chunk of land u.p. there that i can, and then put it all in the cfa program so we can all use it forever.
 

jime

Active member
wow you are really whipped up. i didn't know saying put your money where your mouth is can be so upsetting. your a stakeholder not a stockholder right. :(

and i cannot explain what certain conservation groups want or who they help.
yes paper companies and logging express their property rights differently.
i do not think social engineering should be done though taxes either.
snowmobiling is not going the way of the buggy whip anytime soon. take a breath and vote.

i seemed to have poked the bear
 
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