2014 Yamaha Viper

[Hoosier]

I'm not sure why you guys think Yamaha is fading away.....Spent 5 days over the past two weeks riding in the Newberry area and saw a ton of Yamaha's, both new and recent, almost all 4S except for a few SRX's and SXR's. I saw the usual Ski-Doo volume and noticed a small but visible number of the new AC's (front suspension is a dead giveaway). What I noticed the most though were all the Rush's, Rush Switchbacks, Rush Adventures and few of the new Indy's...and based on the colors most of these were 2012's and 2013's. Compared to 10 years ago when Polaris and AC seemed to dominate, there is much more of a balance between the 4, with AC being 4 now. Again, just my comments from 5 days of riding - nothing scientific about my survey. Your results may vary!

Noticed the same thing last week riding between Eagle River, WI and Copper Harbor - many more Yamahas than you'd expect given the presumed sale figures. Not sure why - do the Yamaha owners ride more the midwest, do they keep their sleds longer? I doubt they sell much in the West. With gas well over $4 all over the Keeweenaw, I know I started thinking more about a 4 stroke (or at least I will when it comes time to pay the credit card).

Provided the Viper turns out to be reliable, this seems to be a positive development for Yamaha - seems to fill a whole in its lineup and they didn't take anything out of it. I saw somewhere else that Yamaha will be introducing a sled to the lineup each year for the next 5 years. So I don't think they are going anywhere.

 

[journeyman]

I know the weights haven't been published but a very good source with strong ties to the R&D folks told me that they took around 70lbs. off the front end of this new sled vs. the Nytro. Only time will tell if this becomes the truth.

 

[fredster]

Hoosier - every time we stop for gas and I put 4 gallons in the Rage and the wife's sled needs 6.2-6.5 (Polaris 600 carb'd) I'm reminded of why I like the 4 stroke!

 

[whitedust]

Hoosier - every time we stop for gas and I put 4 gallons in the Rage and the wife's sled needs 6.2-6.5 (Polaris 600 carb'd) I'm reminded of why I like the 4 stroke!

Yeppers riding with a doo 550 fan 2s rental me on my Yam Attak 4s we stop for gas I put in 3.1Regular gallons about $12 he puts in 3.5 of Premium about $16. $4 dollars difference total waste of money & I'm not including his cost for 2s oil.

 

[Deleted member 10829]

Yeppers riding with a doo 550 fan 2s rental me on my Yam Attak 4s we stop for gas I put in 3.1Regular gallons about $12 he puts in 3.5 of Premium about $16. $4 dollars difference total waste of money & I'm not including his cost for 2s oil.

LOL!! The guy on the doo 550 can buy tons of gas and oil for the $5,000 less he paid for his sled, plus buy you lunch. Even new comparing apples to apples, you pay several thousand more for a Yamaha and that's lots of gas and oil!

 

[whitedust]

LOL!! The guy on the doo 550 can buy tons of gas and oil for the $5,000 less he paid for his sled, plus buy you lunch. Even new comparing apples to apples, you pay several thousand more for a Yamaha and that's lots of gas and oil!

As I said Mark it was rental & I was riding my Attak as the sled I currently own we filled up & those were the cost differences for those particular engines & sleds on that particular day no one was saying anything more than the gas & oil costs no ROI on purchasing any 1 sled over another where did that come from? My question to the renter was why the Premimum gas & he said the rental agency told him this is the gas you must use.

 

[catman66]

That is a sharp sled, but I don't believe Cat guys would jump ship for it.

Can't wait to see the line-ups from those 2 companies. Should be interesting.

Cat guys should not have to jump ship if the rest of the rumors hold, AC will have Yamaha motors in them next year. Rumor has it they parted way with Suzuki.

 

[EXCESSIVE FORCE]

Hoosier - every time we stop for gas and I put 4 gallons in the Rage and the wife's sled needs 6.2-6.5 (Polaris 600 carb'd) I'm reminded of why I like the 4 stroke!

The 4 stroke engine will be the death of a few pit stops.......

 

[Hoosier]

Hoosier - every time we stop for gas and I put 4 gallons in the Rage and the wife's sled needs 6.2-6.5 (Polaris 600 carb'd) I'm reminded of why I like the 4 stroke!

Yeah, the last place we gassed up was at Krupps. Premium gas was darn close to $5. Guy in front of me (different group) was riding some kind of Yamaha and was surprised at the cost, but he only put in about 4.5 gallons. I of course dropped in about 9 and then went in and bought a quart of Amsoil. We spent part of the day on the powerlines, so I get that the four strokes might be too heavy for some guys, but if gas is going to stay over $3 and you want to ride 200+ miles/day, it starts to be a no-brainer on the 4 stroke. All in my opinion.

 

[gogebic_sledder]

Yeah, the last place we gassed up was at Krupps. Premium gas was darn close to $5. Guy in front of me (different group) was riding some kind of Yamaha and was surprised at the cost, but he only put in about 4.5 gallons. I of course dropped in about 9 and then went in and bought a quart of Amsoil. We spent part of the day on the powerlines, so I get that the four strokes might be too heavy for some guys, but if gas is going to stay over $3 and you want to ride 200+ miles/day, it starts to be a no-brainer on the 4 stroke. All in my opinion.

Drive a 600 etec easy and it will get 20mpg easily, run it hard it will get 16mpg. Sorry but that puts a big wrench in your theory, add a 137" track and you have boondocking machine that weighs close to 100 lbs less than pre 2014 4 stroke yamaha. Sorry for going off topic but 2 strokes can get great mpg

 

[journeyman]

Drive a 600 etec easy and it will get 20mpg easily, run it hard it will get 16mpg. Sorry but that puts a big wrench in your theory, add a 137" track and you have boondocking machine that weighs close to 100 lbs less than pre 2014 4 stroke yamaha. Sorry for going off topic but 2 strokes can get great mpg

The E-tecs do good on mileage but being realistic you are still burning 2 smoke oil. It still stinks and it isn't cheap. Also there is no way in heck anyone's 2 stroke will last as long as a 4 stroke both with proper maintenance being equal. Also you are always searching for the higher priced premo fuel without ethanol for a 2 stroke. I know, I own one too. I actually went to the Yamaha show in Mpls. I picked up the new Viper by the front bumper to my chest. It feels about the same weight in front as the old 2 stroke Viper. I tried to do this to a Nytro sitting next to it. Can't do it. It's too darn heavy unless you are Hulk Hogan. Sounds like that sled will be going away soon.

Cat is going to have this same version out of their own with the Nytro motor but it will have Cat clutches so it will not run as strong. Yamaha's clutches are that much better to the point that Yamaha had to get Cat to make taller gears. With the Yamaha clutches it can pull more gear. Yamaha has been up in TRF for almost a year and has significantly upped the ante on their quality control. I see a win win for both companies. Yamaha also hinted there will be a turbo version of this sled coming within a year and will have a total of 5 new machines for the next 5 years to come.

 

[Hoosier]

Drive a 600 etec easy and it will get 20mpg easily, run it hard it will get 16mpg. Sorry but that puts a big wrench in your theory, add a 137" track and you have boondocking machine that weighs close to 100 lbs less than pre 2014 4 stroke yamaha. Sorry for going off topic but 2 strokes can get great mpg

How long does an Etec last though? Guy in my group has 12,000 miles on a Cat 700 and another has 10,000 on a Poo 600 carb, but I don't hear of guys doing the same on the newer leaned-out EFI 2 strokes. If you're only getting 5,000 miles before a rebuild, that takes away the savings. Not saying it doesn't happen occasionally, but these 18 mpg 100:1 2 strokes generally aren't going 10,000 miles, at least from what I've seen. Maybe more of them are, and they just haven't been around long enough for the stories to get out. If they can do that, then I completely agree with you - I wouldn't see the point of a 4 stroke for the non-100% trail rider.

 

[kip]

mspease,

I just can't help it, you're a moderator. A moderator does not choose sides and it's obvious you hate Yamaha's which is fine but keep it to yourself if you're going to be a moderator. I don't know why people argue over this anyway. It's all opinion!!! The fact is that a 4stroke is much more efficient than a two otherwise they would be in our cars! Also, you don't pay thousands more. MSRP don't mean crap. Nothing sells for MSRP. Apples for Apples hey, okay mspease. A 550 ski-doo is the platform. How much for oil? How much for gas? How much for offseason ethanol treatment? How much for rings and pistons and trust me you will be doing that normal 2 stroke maintenance. Sale price roughly 6500 for a 2013 MXZ 550 ES. Equivalent Yamaha to that would be a 500 liquid cooled Phazer which is by the way liquid cooled and fuel injected. Sale price is 7995. More motor, better mileage, no oil usage, better resale value by a land slide. Runs much more consistant in all temperature conditions than a fan cooled. Do the math, don't take long to make up 1400 dollars and the value is there without even considering the savings after the purchase. I've met you and like you and I would help you like any other sledder on the trail regardless of brand but your lack of good decision making as a moderator is pretty painful. If you hate Yamaha's so much then quit spending all of your time following the threads that have anything to do with Yamaha. Mspease, come on man, really?

 

[jd]

mspease,

I just can't help it, you're a moderator. A moderator does not choose sides ...

Actually Kip, a moderator on this board is more than welcome to choose sides or give their opinion. All posters are, including moderators. The moderators just help me make sure all the posts on the board are within the rules. They are by no means required to remain neutral or sit on the sidelines of a discussion.

-John

 

[kip]

Ok John, understood. I would think a better choice of words could be used rather than moderator for a person who can give their opinion. My apologies to mspease Moderator to me means non bias. My mistake.

 

[gogebic_sledder]

How long does an Etec last though? Guy in my group has 12,000 miles on a Cat 700 and another has 10,000 on a Poo 600 carb, but I don't hear of guys doing the same on the newer leaned-out EFI 2 strokes. If you're only getting 5,000 miles before a rebuild, that takes away the savings. Not saying it doesn't happen occasionally, but these 18 mpg 100:1 2 strokes generally aren't going 10,000 miles, at least from what I've seen. Maybe more of them are, and they just haven't been around long enough for the stories to get out. If they can do that, then I completely agree with you - I wouldn't see the point of a 4 stroke for the non-100% trail rider.

3,000 miles on mine so far runs flawlessly, will it run 20,000 miles before it explodes probably not. But that's not why I bought it, I was just pointing out that 4 strokes aren't the only sleds good on fuel. Light weight DI 2 strokes are only getting more popular.

 

[whitedust]

I have PMed Mark in the past & I know Mark likes 4s sleds & had one & would probably buy a Poo 4s again if Poo was in the 4s game. Mark does not seem to like the Yamaha brand much not sure why?.... but had the impression he has a strong dealer loyal end user to Poo dealer relationship. Sometimes the dealer can make the difference in what you purchase. I'm not defending Mark just what I learned by website PMs back & forth.

 

[lenny]

you really learn a lot when you ride all the sleds. Since I own a lodging business I often ride with many of my renters and like I have said in the past, I get to ride all the sleds. I cannot think of a single sled I rode that I did not like. They all feel different and look different but they do feel good. Yamaha has come a long way in the ride department and I defend this statement based upon riding the sleds, not just spouting off bias. Right out the gate I have loved 4s grunt and have ridden all 4 4s sleds, obviously old poo 4 and it was fine. Yamaha has technology borrowed from their bike segment and refined the tech in the sled department. Riding a sled is the best way to determine if it is for you or not. Believing what you here from others is not so good a way to decide what to buy. I rode a Ski doo mxzx ace and loved it, a much different ride but I can strongly appreciate a nice cruiser. I also rode the cat 1100 and that machine rocks. I own a Yamaha 4 stroke and it needs no turbo. There all good and you will not find me strongly criticizing the other 3. I may defend my preference but not bash the others,,,,how about the poo 800's,,that's a friendly like zing zing. Gotta go chain the front of my Yammi to the one ton hoist so I change the oil,,,zing zing!