2017 Sneak Peek Impressions?

[Cirrus_Driver]

do u have the numbers to prove that ? that book is not ez to come by .

Ive seen doo market it and dealers as well. I guess they could be blowing smoke along with 2015s 48% market share?

Thr numbers i saw for 2015 was
doo 48%
Poo 30%
Cat 19%
Yam 3%[/QUOTE]

You'd have to quote a source on that. I doubt that big of a gap between Doo and Poo, and also doubt 3% Yam - they are at the bottom, but more likely 7-8%. I don't think those numbers are available - they aren't published, just like Yamaha's dry weights.

Abe - how do you like your ACE 900 and do you have the PB80 on it? I'm seriously considering a members '15, but don't really want the Renegade. Is yours a shorty or long? Thanks

 

[snobuilder]

do u have the numbers to prove that ? that book is not ez to come by .

Ive seen doo market it and dealers as well. I guess they could be blowing smoke along with 2015s 48% market share?

Thr numbers i saw for 2015 was
doo 48%
Poo 30%
Cat 19%
Yam 3%[/QUOTE]

Again....no source.

 

[old abe]

Truthfully, I was really afraid of what I had bought for my wife. But I love the thing. It just plain surprises me in what it will do so well. Deep snow is not a problem. Not as light up front as E-Tech 600, but very close! It's a Renegade, so as it is geared lower than the shorter 120's. And that is what makes it quick out of the gate! Last 3 sleds all 137, 136's. Not sure as to the 129 gearing. MPG's 20 all the time, on any gas. E-87 no problem. Running stock E-Drive clutch, with the Dalton rollers. Prior to 16 models, stock rollers would flat spot. Dalton's fixed that problem. Would have bought another one, but waited on the 17's intro. Dumb move on my part. Those deals on the 16's were the way to go!

 

[Cirrus_Driver]

Thanks - would you think there's much drop-off in performance between the Renegade and the shorty? I'm concerned about all that additional rotating mass, even with the Cudney PB80. How does your wife like the handling of the sled, and the Renegade in particular? Assuming you/her have experience with both.

 

[ezra]

do u have the numbers to prove that ? that book is not ez to come by .

Ive seen doo market it and dealers as well. I guess they could be blowing smoke along with 2015s 48% market share?

Thr numbers i saw for 2015 was
doo 48%
Poo 30%
Cat 19%
Yam 3%[/QUOTE]
dealers do not get those numbers
they may get what the HQ marketing department sends to them to push but that's about it.
I am still uncertain if any of them make public of # of models sold .
real ez to make those sales numbers look better than they are for the glossy print when u build a few diff products . not saying that is what is going on but then why not

 

[Hoosier]

Most of the time you see market share quoted it's North America only - Yamaha is very low in the US/Canada but does better overseas, which is 1/3 of the worldwide market now. They are still under 10% worldwide. And market share is measured on sleds shipped by the manufacturer, not necessarily sold to the consumer. And the manufacturers play with the numbers a bit by getting shipments out by quarter-end one year when they need to, or after quarter end when they don't.

It would be interesting to see a comparison of the sled registrations - when you ride in the UP, it's hard to believe that Yamaha has such a low market share but those guys probably keep their sleds longer than others too. I imagine you see almost no Yamaha's in the West.

 

[old abe]

XXX007; The Renegade lower gearing really helps on the get go. Have not rode a shorty. All recent sleds renegades. We just like what the extra length gives us. We do not use studs. Gave up on that pain in the butt long ago. Converted my riding bud to this also with 137. We have no problems on the tight trails as far as handling goes. I like the E-Drive clutch. 16's fixed the roller problems, and calibrated better also. The sled is very well balanced. I know the shorter ace 900's are faster on top end, but give some up out of the gate, which is the gearing. Front end is some heavier than E-Tech 600, but not by much. My wife notices this more than I, and she would not want anything heavier up front. I was very concerned with the ace 900 on long Canadian trips as for having enough power. Such as when encountering a day with fresh deep snow to bust for miles on end. Very surprised to find out this thing would handle it very well. It is very capable in deep snow. Plain surprising. It's easier than any sled I ever owned as to get unstuck due to the ECO mode, and no track spin. XCSP on JDee has a GSX. Perhaps he you also. I believe Grub, and Pit Grunt also ride ace 900's. Good luck to you.

 

[ezra]

any of u guys with the 900 put the reflash in it that a lot of the sea doo spark guys have been running ? I know of a hand full of sparks with no issues in 2 yrs with flash but I think load is a lot less stressfull spinning a impeller

 

[old abe]

ezra; I have not seen anything to get excited about ace sled reflash. I have heard as you say about the Spark PWC. It would be nice to be able to get the same results on a sled. I am going to try some different clutching set ups next year. Nothing wild, just boost the top end RPM to 7400.

 

[Hoosier]

XXX007; The Renegade lower gearing really helps on the get go. Have not rode a shorty. All recent sleds renegades. We just like what the extra length gives us. We do not use studs. Gave up on that pain in the butt long ago. Converted my riding bud to this also with 137. We have no problems on the tight trails as far as handling goes. I like the E-Drive clutch. 16's fixed the roller problems, and calibrated better also. The sled is very well balanced. I know the shorter ace 900's are faster on top end, but give some up out of the gate, which is the gearing. Front end is some heavier than E-Tech 600, but not by much. My wife notices this more than I, and she would not want anything heavier up front. I was very concerned with the ace 900 on long Canadian trips as for having enough power. Such as when encountering a day with fresh deep snow to bust for miles on end. Very surprised to find out this thing would handle it very well. It is very capable in deep snow. Plain surprising. It's easier than any sled I ever owned as to get unstuck due to the ECO mode, and no track spin. XCSP on JDee has a GSX. Perhaps he you also. I believe Grub, and Pit Grunt also ride ace 900's. Good luck to you.

Good to hear you had good luck with the 900 in Canada. When I was up there this winter I was wondering how it would work up there - does it get up to 70 quick enough? Seems like the 0 - 70 or 30 - 70 would be most important. We didn't play off trail as much this year because of snow conditions but the range would have been awesome to have. Plus no worries about junk gas. I don't know the doo lingo - is the e-drive clutch stock? My father in law puts on a lot of miles in northern wisconsin and the up every year (is retired up there) and picked up a 16 900 at the end of the season this year. Replaced a Poo 600. Be interested to see how he likes it.

 

[old abe]

Hoosier; We have not had the 900 to Canada as yet. It will next year!!!!!! It will do fine up there from what conditions, and where we have been with it. Had some concerns as to the power, but was dead wrong. It pulls great, and it's a joy to ride. It's not a high performance top end racer, and was not bought for that. 600 E-Tech has better top speed, but not by much. Tight trails it's a blast. 0 to 65 it is very quick. From there on up not as fast. 87 on GPS, 93 on speedo. 50 to 70 cruise, no problem. E-Drive is stock clutch. I like it. Replaced stock rollers that flat spotted with the Dalton's. Full shift out always now. 2016 sleds suppose to have fixed the roller problem, and have a better calibration set up. I will re calibrate ours to the 2016 specs next year, and push top RPM up 200 to 300. The 2016 left over deals were the way to go for sure. If your FIL likes to ride, he should really enjoy his 900. This sled will never wear you out. You'll always want more. Enjoy!

 

[Cirrus_Driver]

I think I'm getting sold on that ACE 900 Rene. The Cudney should give you a couple MPH on the dream-meter with the higher RPM it generates.

 

[1fujifilm]

Thanks - would you think there's much drop-off in performance between the Renegade and the shorty? I'm concerned about all that additional rotating mass, even with the Cudney PB80. How does your wife like the handling of the sled, and the Renegade in particular? Assuming you/her have experience with both.

Been riding Ski-Doo since 2004 and switched to Renegades only in 2009 due to wanting to bridge moguls at the end of the day on the railroad grade and have the better associated ride. Three things occur to me;
-The short track is not faster due to losing the traction in a few inches of fluff that the Renegade picks up with longer track and deeper lug. The Renegade hooks up better and feels faster while accelerating.
-On a perfectly groomed trail that is hard snow (no powder), the short track can be about 5 mph faster above 75 mph.
-Gas Mpg seems about the same as related to the benefits spoken in bullet #1.
I ride exclusively north of Watersmeet and need the Renegade, if one rides south I might say either one will have their benefits.

If you get a friendly Dealer, the price difference is only $175.

Bear

 

[1fujifilm]

Truthfully, I was really afraid of what I had bought for my wife. But I love the thing. It just plain surprises me in what it will do so well. Deep snow is not a problem. Not as light up front as E-Tech 600, but very close! It's a Renegade, so as it is geared lower than the shorter 120's. And that is what makes it quick out of the gate! Last 3 sleds all 137, 136's. Not sure as to the 129 gearing. MPG's 20 all the time, on any gas. E-87 no problem. Running stock E-Drive clutch, with the Dalton rollers. Prior to 16 models, stock rollers would flat spot. Dalton's fixed that problem. Would have bought another one, but waited on the 17's intro. Dumb move on my part. Those deals on the 16's were the way to go!

Hi Abe,
I owned and rode a 16 Renegade 600 E-Tec last year and was able to trade sleds with a friend for 50 miles (Grand Marias, MI area) that rode a 16 900 Ace Renegade (bright orange, loved that),I loved the 900 with one notable issue; the throttle was about a linear as a mountain pass in Colorado. I hated the throttle as there was no middle range of throttle, either it was all on or off. I toggled through the programming options and none of them helped. I thought; "is this programming needed due to it being a 4-stroke"? No, I have ridden a Viper that had excellent throttle range, so what gives? It seems like an area that needs improvement. Other than that, the weighting and handling of the sled seemed very nice and similar to the 600.

Bear

 

[ezra]

ezra; I have not seen anything to get excited about ace sled reflash. I have heard as you say about the Spark PWC. It would be nice to be able to get the same results on a sled. I am going to try some different clutching set ups next year. Nothing wild, just boost the top end RPM to 7400.

wonder why? the tune for spark it like 20hp I assume the flash for a ski doo would be real close . I know if I had 1 it would be to tempting not to try it .even if my ridding bud did not have the multi tune license I would prob fork over the 400 bucks

 

[old abe]

1fujifilm; In sport mode our 900 does not act linear whats so ever. Huge difference from standard mode to sport mode. Our electronic throttle works great. Some do not like the way it works.

 

[old abe]

XXX007; I'm going to stay with the E-Drive clutch. The Cudney set up with the PB80, and others also using the PB80 will really improve over all performance. I'm only looking to improve a little top end pull. I don't want to take away any of the things I like the way they are. Doo Doctor, Goodwin, others, and now Doo providing upgrades to the stock E-Drive clutching. I think the E-Drive is a very capable, durable clutch, and generates very low heat (= long belt life). But there are many PB80's out there, it's a good clutch, and easy to tune.

 

[eagle1]

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[eagle1]

As good as doo is selling 4s you would think doo would promote the Ace at Sneak Peek...they sure didn't at Wausau it was all 850 & Gen 4. This was a big ? in my mind almost like doo wants their 4s customers to buy an 850 or etec 2s which is not going to happen very often apples & oranges market. Also felt the same with Poo no Indy? With all the in season Indy hype then not show it? Idk?

Sneak Peak is about what's new and spring special orders/ color choices. Think they're thinking is "why bring sleds that aren't high volume spring/special order and can be seen at dealers."
Want an ace, its and in season model and can stop at any dealer and check them out.
Kinda same with indy, it's in season model. But guess what, no 800 this year!!
Also interesting you can now get 144" 600 switchback sp. Basically same as assault minus the name and shocks.
Now who can tell me the difference between a pro-x and XCR? That's probably biggest surprise for me is manufacturers continue to make so many models with subtle differences.
.

 

[whitedust]

Sneak Peak is about what's new and spring special orders/ color choices. Think they're thinking is "why bring sleds that aren't high volume spring/special order and can be seen at dealers."
Want an ace, its and in season model and can stop at any dealer and check them out.
Kinda same with indy, it's in season model. But guess what, no 800 this year!!
Also interesting you can now get 144" 600 switchback sp. Basically same as assault minus the name and shocks.
Now who can tell me the difference between a pro-x and XCR? That's probably biggest surprise for me is manufacturers continue to make so many models with subtle differences.
.

It is getting more difficult now to see all OEMs with all models under 1 roof. Granted some models are just different track & shocks so I don't mind that so much. No Indy & no Doo Enduro at all seemed goofy to me.