American Chopper Jr. vs. Sr. vs. Jessie James

[nhra1000]

What I find interesting is how all the emphasis is on building or "fabricating" as some like to call it. I understand that metal working is a skill and thus it takes skill to build these bikes. But most or even all of those skills can be taught. It just takes some folks longer to reach a certain level.

Design is a talent that is very hard to teach. In fact, I would say that pure artistic design can't be taught. It is a skill that someone posses or not.

I can build just about anything out of wood- given enough time and the proper tools. Ask to me to design from scratch some of the works of furniture I see designed by others and there is no way. Not in my lifetime anyway. When I sit down to design something, I am almost always borrowing from works I have seen already and combining concepts to come up with my own "design".

-John

I'd agree on the design side. Some people just have the instincts and creativity. On the fab side I disagree somewhat...I believe the mechanical abilty is born into the person. The best guys are the ones who just "get it" there are others who can overcome and teach themselves but still nowhere near the others. JMO

 

[tealracing16]

Wow I always thought I was a "real rider" because I'm not afraid to ride high miles in a day. I didn't know I had to ride a long front end rigid rear 500 miles to be thought of as "real." What about the people that put 30K/year on a Honda, they must all be "fake" riders because they don't build there own bikes. Oh and they better not bolt on something that would make their riding easier either. Posers. What about the "real" riders that won't ride their bikes to work because it might get dirty?

I agree 100% with John. I could build a bike just like Jesse's given enought time to learn and the tools to do it. But to design from scratch like Junior or that schmuck at OCC (Jason) I couldn't do that.

 

[Deleted member 10829]

It is fun reading the comments about the show and builds. I agree that there should have been some rules to define what the builds should result in. We need to remember that it was a made for TV special - it got people to watch! My wife and I both predicted the finish before the show started - think about who is doing the voting. Jr is the sentimental favorite to all the women since his dad is mean to him. Sr is out because he is mean to Jr. JJ is out because of all the mean things that he did in his relationship to Sandra Bullock, etc. I'm sure a lot of people voted the way they did because of this.

Only one problem with your theory on voting. They had 3 "experts" there that also made their picks. 2 out of 3 picked Junior. 66% to 33%, even more lopsided than the fan voting.

 

[mustardbucket2]

Only one problem with your theory on voting. They had 3 "experts" there that also made their picks. 2 out of 3 picked Junior. 66% to 33%, even more lopsided than the fan voting.

The smaller the size of the statistical sample (3 experts) will yield larger percentages of variance like you said, 66% to 33%. Did the announcer ever say what the public voting percentages were? I didn't see it.

The "experts" were giving their subjective opinions on each vehicle, since there was no judging criteria to grade by. It made for drama TV - and I keep forgetting that most things on TV are real......

 

[mikes99ss]

Two quotes that i think tell the story. Vinnie was looking at some of JJ's bike from the past and said" they area really nice bikes but you can go to bikefest and see 100's of bikes just like that. And on stage when they asked SR. what he thought of JJ's bike he said " i love springers, I have a few just like that at home". JJ's may have been a "real" bike but it wasn't anything new. If it's all about ridability then i think i win. I have an 06 Yamaha v star 1100 with a mustang seat, backrest, Tom tom gps wired direct, Highway pegs and a spare cigarette lighter for charging cell phones. Super comfortable but lets face it. It's just like any other bike on the road in the summer. THAT, is why me or my bike are not on tv and that is why JJ's bike did not win.

 

[nhra1000]

Wow I always thought I was a "real rider" because I'm not afraid to ride high miles in a day. I didn't know I had to ride a long front end rigid rear 500 miles to be thought of as "real." What about the people that put 30K/year on a Honda, they must all be "fake" riders because they don't build there own bikes. Oh and they better not bolt on something that would make their riding easier either. Posers. What about the "real" riders that won't ride their bikes to work because it might get dirty?

I agree 100% with John. I could build a bike just like Jesse's given enought time to learn and the tools to do it. But to design from scratch like Junior or that schmuck at OCC (Jason) I couldn't do that.

If this was directed at me...you may want to go re-read what I said...Where did I mention anything about real riders only ride choppers 500 miles? I said that should be apart of the build off.....and I think it should. Where did I mention Posers or fake? Ive ridden rigid choppers 500 miles and it isnt fun...How is that atking a shot at anybody else?

 

[Deleted member 10829]

Two quotes that i think tell the story. Vinnie was looking at some of JJ's bike from the past and said" they area really nice bikes but you can go to bikefest and see 100's of bikes just like that. And on stage when they asked SR. what he thought of JJ's bike he said " i love springers, I have a few just like that at home". JJ's may have been a "real" bike but it wasn't anything new.

Exactly.

 

[polarisrider1]

I wonder how many Harley riders voted for either Jr. or Sr. not many I am sure. The contest needed far more definition of what is to be expected. Sr. should have been disqualified for building whatever it was, but not a bike. Jesse is Jesse. He was trying to make a point that you can build a decoration for the front lobby of corporate USA or you can build with your heart and make a bike a biker would ride. I go with the biker type bike everytime. As far as JJ bringing in help towards the end, well he did bring in guys who build just like him. Jr and Sr. both had a whole company working on their show pieces from the start. JJ did not need a computer to build his bike. I do know that Sr. knows how to blacksmith, he sold his wrought iron business to his brother. Sr. should of stepped up and built a bike but I bet his accountants said, let's minimize your loses, You still have an empire to try to hold up.

 

[700classic]

JJ's was a rider, but I sure would've liked to take Sr's for a ride. Looked like it would be a blast!

 

[lenny]

so your basically saying JJ keeps the biker image real and the rest are bolt on corporate bling greed. So if Jr didn't run his exhaust throught the tank forcing him to have a small fuel cell elswhere and had a typical fuel capacity than he would of been okay or is he still a poser because he builds theme bikes in 2 weeks. Very few of Jr's bikes don't hold 3-4 gallons and most can be driven long distances. I can say for sure you would be much more comfortable on Jr's bike on long rides compared to JJ's. JJ looked like he was unsafe and uncomfortable. Here's a 2003 OCC chopper every bit as good as JJ bike

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QJvQhp8HpB4&feature=player_detailpage

I wonder how many Harley riders voted for either Jr. or Sr. not many I am sure. The contest needed far more definition of what is to be expected. Sr. should have been disqualified for building whatever it was, but not a bike. Jesse is Jesse. He was trying to make a point that you can build a decoration for the front lobby of corporate USA or you can build with your heart and make a bike a biker would ride. I go with the biker type bike everytime. As far as JJ bringing in help towards the end, well he did bring in guys who build just like him. Jr and Sr. both had a whole company working on their show pieces from the start. JJ did not need a computer to build his bike. I do know that Sr. knows how to blacksmith, he sold his wrought iron business to his brother. Sr. should of stepped up and built a bike but I bet his accountants said, let's minimize your loses, You still have an empire to try to hold up.

 

[tealracing16]

If this was directed at me...you may want to go re-read what I said...Where did I mention anything about real riders only ride choppers 500 miles? I said that should be apart of the build off.....and I think it should. Where did I mention Posers or fake? Ive ridden rigid choppers 500 miles and it isnt fun...How is that atking a shot at anybody else?

It wasn't meant to be directed at anyone person, I just don't understand why there is such an argument about this. I agree with you about having to ride it 500 miles. The coolest thing I ever saw was JJ rebuilding an engine on the side of the road on his way to Sturgis after he had just gotten done building the bike.

But... to each his own, I wouldn't ride without a windshield because I don't like everthing hitting me.

The posers were the people that will argue about how they are the baddest motorcycle riders in the world, usually v-twin air cooled riders, yet won't ride their bikes to work if they will get dusty in th eparking lot, or won't ride in the rain etc. I would love the challenge of riding a chopper, but it isnt my cup of tea. The "real" rider comment was just about what I said. What constitutes a "rider". Is it miles in a year, is it how cold you will ride in, what is the definition? What about a guy who rides 200 miles on a scooter? Isn't he a lot tougher than an Ultra Classic driver?

 

[polarisrider1]

http://dsc.discovery.com/videos/american-chopper-occ-build-off-aftershow.html#mkcpgn=fbtlc2 This answers it all.

 

[wags]

Why are they in business? To make money just like all other business owners. If someone wants a "theme bike" built based on their product and they call JJ do you think he will turn down 100K? I don't think so. You can't knock Jr or Sr they are simply business men. Jr is by far the more creative out of the 3. If I wanted a bike built as a daily driver than JJ is the guy, If I wanted a "theme" bike that is "bolt" together I go to Sr. and if I want an "out of the box" creation I go to Jr.

It's all about the almighty dollar any way you cut it.

 

[polarisrider1]

Why are they in business? To make money just like all other business owners. If someone wants a "theme bike" built based on their product and they call JJ do you think he will turn down 100K? I don't think so. You can't knock Jr or Sr they are simply business men. Jr is by far the more creative out of the 3. If I wanted a bike built as a daily driver than JJ is the guy, If I wanted a "theme" bike that is "bolt" together I go to Sr. and if I want an "out of the box" creation I go to Jr.

It's all about the almighty dollar any way you cut it.

Yes it is.