Last Saturday picked up a 2015 Vector LTX. What I didn't know was they come from the factory with 2" carbides on the inside and a hard bar on the outside keel of the Tuners. Asked the dealer to put on 4" carbides which he did but put the 4" on the outside and left the 2" on the inside. These are the 1st set of tuners I have owned but rode my son's Apex with Tuners and 4" carbides and it felt very jittery, not darting, but did not feel relaxed on it. From what I have read, the longer carbide should go on the inside keel. Any suggestions would be appreciated.
Carbides on Tuner Skis
- Thread starter Banjo Man
- Start date
We don't mess with tuners anymore and whole bunch of different carbide set ups you can try. We found the single keel Yam stockers with aggressive snowtrackers kick butt. Nothing else comes close to precise & effortless steering of stockers with STs. No darting what so ever for Apex, Venture & Vector. You have to back off on ski pressure set up as directed but once you get fined tuned nothing better. Your choice to continue with tuners but we won't. To me tuners would have been a great asset back in 2007 or so but snowtrackers took care of the Yami ski problem years ago.
groomerdriver
New member
Why only 2007?
I've run Doolies on my single keel Yami skis since 2005 and I have those same skis (17,000 miles) with Doolies on my 14 Vector LTX.....don't care for the Tuners due to the same jittery feeling. ZERO darting with the Doolies.....no push that I feel...and they last forever.
Seems to be a love/hate thing with Snowtrackers. I'd try a pair of ST's but only if I could get a used set that had a decent amount of life on them. New ones are very expensive.
Bottom line...ditch your Tuners.
To each their own I guess, but I've got 6" on the inside and 4" on the outside on my LTX DX and have no problems with darting or turning. The wife's LTX DX has 4" on each keel and she has no complaints at all. I guess because we are not super aggressive riders the tuners work great for us. Even when I'm riding with the guys and we light the wick a bit, I have no complaints.
I think what we are getting at here is tuner tech can only do better but not cure jitters & darting on Yamaha sleds in my case my experience from 2007 on to 2016 darting has been present tuners or single keel. Last couple of years Yami has redesigned the tuner trying to improve which is a good thing but aftermarket had a huge opp curing darting on Yams for many years & has done well with different products on the single keel skis. I have used Bergstrom single bars with ski savers & triple points with triple points the best of his products but darting still there. My bud uses stud boy duece bars which were surprisingly good while shapers were dogs imo on single keelers. The stud boy duece bars on single keelers reasonable correction at a bargin price. Snow Trackers are a carbide system much like the bergstrom solution with ski savers & priced about the same at $200. I rode dfattacks 2012 Apex XTX with snow trackers & I stood there with one of my perplexed looks...lol.. his STs just kicked the butt of my 2012 Apex XTX with triple points. So I knew right there STs were going on my sled. Fast forward to today and bud with stud boy duece bars just can't keep up he puts out so much more effort than us & is on Apex 128 while we are on 144s we should be eating his dust but this is where best tech pays off in a day of riding. Your choice of course but I would ditch tuners buy Yami single keel skis put on STs and enjoy the ride.
What I think I am going to do is swap the 4" to the inside and the 2" to the outside and try it out. This sled has not seen snow yet and bringing it up Sunday night to try it out. Got a pair of 6" triple points in my garage up north so maybe go with that. They did, however cause some darting on my 06 Vector with the single keel. Thanks for all the info. The dealer did state that the new tuners were an improvement over the older ones so will see.
agriffinjd
New member
I had a 2011 Nytro XTX. Used studboy deuce bar on the stock skiis at first, then tried the tuner skiis. Loved the tuners. I used 6" Woody's trailblzer IV on the inside keel, and a 4" Woody's on the outside keel. I heard the stock yamaha carbides were garbage so I never used them. With my combo I had no issues of darting, and turning was a whole lot easier. I rode aggressively on them and loved them.
journeyman
New member
I did a lot of reading before I purchased skis this year for my Attak and the story I keep hearing on the dual keel skis is you only need carbide on the inside runner because that does the bulk of the work for turning. It was suggested to just use a hardweld on the outside keel. I was getting all sorts of mixed reports on Tuners so I chose not to go that route.
I ran Dually's on the stock skis originally and though they did not dart I did have my fair share of push in the corners so I took them off. Last year I ran 6" Stud Boy Shapers and they were not bad.
This year I went with the Curve XS skis with a 4" carbide. They are decent but not perfect. Now I am kind of wishing I would have tried the factory mountain ski bottoms with Snowtrackers. I may do that next season, who knows.
My good friend has a 2011 XTX Apex that came with the Simmons Gen. II dual carbide Flexi skis. I have to say they are pretty nice and don't seem to dart at all and turn on a dime. I am not sure if they have carbide on each runner or just the inside keel.
I ran Dually's on the stock skis originally and though they did not dart I did have my fair share of push in the corners so I took them off. Last year I ran 6" Stud Boy Shapers and they were not bad.
This year I went with the Curve XS skis with a 4" carbide. They are decent but not perfect. Now I am kind of wishing I would have tried the factory mountain ski bottoms with Snowtrackers. I may do that next season, who knows.
My good friend has a 2011 XTX Apex that came with the Simmons Gen. II dual carbide Flexi skis. I have to say they are pretty nice and don't seem to dart at all and turn on a dime. I am not sure if they have carbide on each runner or just the inside keel.
snobuilder
Well-known member
Do trail conditions vary where you ride? They sure do where I trail ride. I LOL when someone says they have the best set up. It just doesn't exist.
6" inside 4" outside with studs on my 12 Apex XTX is the best I have come up with for my riding style. I bought new ST and tried them for 400 miles, sold them! My wife loves Triple points on her Apex.
6286 miles on my sled with Tuner skis. All Northern Wisconsin trails.
6286 miles on my sled with Tuner skis. All Northern Wisconsin trails.
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groomerdriver
New member
You are right in this one IMO. I we try to find the setup that works the best in the conditions we experience?
journeyman
New member
I find the type of snow and temperature is really key when it comes to darting. When we venture north towards the Copper Harbor I find the snow is usually pure lake effect sugar snow. It just doesn't seem to pack. Pretty much everyone in my group mentions darting in those conditions. When we get farther south it doesn't seem to be as noticeable.
T
Tracker
Guest
journeyman not to start a huge argument as others will completely disagree but try this. it will work. I had same problem and now no darting or pushing and its because of this statement....
Snowmobile tracks also provide traction on slippery surfaces like snow and ice, where regular wheels would slip and slide. The large surface area and the roughness of the treads create friction between the snowmobile and the surface, giving the snowmobile a better grip
tracks usually serve to steer as well as propel the vehicle,
that last sentence. think about it if your sled pushes. go back to the 4 inch dually carbides and lengthen your limiter strap so that the track lays as flat as you can. the more flatter the more surface area and as above...giving the snowmobile a better grip. doing this WILL eliminate the push. I guarantee it since it did on mine and others we have done this too as well. go opposite of everyone tells you since doing that the track will now help you not push and will help turn as well as the carbides. the other way with it raised. makes just the skis and the carbides do most of the work and only the end of the track is touching ground and swiveling or pivoting which is why the sled pushes. try its an easy setup fix for THE PERFECT SETUP. and you can always go back if desired. the perfect setup...of which there is one of course. lets us know how you like it after doing that. put about 500 miles on that way. then report back. you almost achieved sled setup nirvana. LOL.
snobuilder
Well-known member
I guess I am confused by the term push in the corners. I though it means the sled wants to go strsight instead of turning.
Not sure how taking off ski pressure by lengthening the limiter strap will help you steer through a corner better.
Not sure how taking off ski pressure by lengthening the limiter strap will help you steer through a corner better.
dfattack
Well-known member
it's all up to the individual I guess. I think I have the perfect setup for me...on my sleds. I have tried woody's dually's (however you spell that) and Bergstrom Triple points on several sleds. All Yamaha's and a couple of Ski-Doos. I went to snow trackers for my 2006 apex and 2007 attak. Made a huge (night and day) difference. Continued with snow trackers after that on my 2011 Apex XTX and 2012 Apex XTX. I then bought my current 2 up a 2013 Venture GT and ordered the tuners skis for it and contacted Scott Bergrstom to try his ideal setup with the tuner skis. Had his triple point on one of the spots on the ski (can't remember inside or out) and a wear bar on the other. Rode about 100 miles with this setup and immediately went back to the stock yamaha skis with snowtrackers. I use the agressive trackers on all the sleds including the Venture (2up). FOR ME...THIS IS MY IDEAL SETUP.
The snowtrackers eliminate the darting and very minimal push in the corners. I would imagine whoever thinks they "aren't all that" hasn't ridden with them or possibly read negative comments online. I've never experienced one of the negative "issues" discussed online except for one...you have to cross railroad tracks head on. They will grab the tracks if snow is not too deep and you cross at an angle.
By the way, I have put literally thousands of miles on my trackers. I don't ride off trail and don't think they would be good for doing the boondocking thing.
I love the security it gives me in the corners not knowing what knucklehead is coming around the corner and that I can react quickly to get out of the way. This is my opinion and you will probably hear many others, but best thing to do is try them and decide for yourself. Hope this helps.
groomerdriver
New member
Order and pay for a set and have them shipped to me. If I like them I'll pay for them. If I don't you can have them back.
Deal?
Deal?
snobuilder
Well-known member
Many horror stories about the trakers in not so ideal conditions...like hard frozen and rutted which IS common for them who ride in all sorts of weather. Having a set of sharp edged c channels on your ski bottoms just doesn't make sense unless you slow way down in them conditions so as not flip the sled when catching a frozen rut on a corner.
I have read many reports from them who otherwise like the trackers that they can be unexpected devils at times.
Tried tuners, sold them the next fall at a swap. C and N trail skis work well.
I have read many reports from them who otherwise like the trackers that they can be unexpected devils at times.
Tried tuners, sold them the next fall at a swap. C and N trail skis work well.