LEGAL off trail riding

[sledjunkie25]

Hello all, as the season approaches I’m starting to do some research on LEGAL off trail riding in MN, WI and MI. The US Forest Service has a lot of great maps and from my understanding, State and Federal land is free game unless otherwise posted (correct me if I am wrong). I am trying to get a more clear answer on power line/high line riding and if it varies from state to state. Just trying to know before we go, we absolutely do not want to be the reason for a trail closure or even a complaint. Thanks guys.

 

[2TrakR]

Powerlines/Pipelines are generally private and illegal to be on. That includes many sections that are also on state/federal land. Their easement does not usually allow public access. There are some sections on public land that are open, but general rule is, just because it's there does not mean it's OK to be on it. If the utility line crosses private land, definitely not legal to be on it, unless it's shared with a designated town/county/state road.

Some USFS roads in MI are not open to snowmobiles, varies by forest. In general snowmobiling is restricted to roads/trails and off-trail (cross country) snowmobiling is not allowed on USFS land.

MI State land doesn't get specific on cross country over snow travel, however if running over saplings/etc, that is not allowed. Sticking to roads/trails is the safe answer.

 

[Skylar]

 

[UP RIDER]

View attachment 62318

Good Info there.

 

[DamageInc]

Powerlines/Pipelines are generally private and illegal to be on. That includes many sections that are also on state/federal land. Their easement does not usually allow public access. There are some sections on public land that are open, but general rule is, just because it's there does not mean it's OK to be on it. If the utility line crosses private land, definitely not legal to be on it, unless it's shared with a designated town/county/state road.

Some USFS roads in MI are not open to snowmobiles, varies by forest. In general snowmobiling is restricted to roads/trails and off-trail (cross country) snowmobiling is not allowed on USFS land.

MI State land doesn't get specific on cross country over snow travel, however if running over saplings/etc, that is not allowed. Sticking to roads/trails is the safe answer.

This is absolutely not true. Many National Forests allow cross-country snowmobiling. The Ottawa NF alone has nearly a million acres of boondocking opportunities (but stay clear of the Wilderness areas).

 

[2TrakR]

This is absolutely not true. Many National Forests allow cross-country snowmobiling. The Ottawa NF alone has nearly a million acres of boondocking opportunities (but stay clear of the Wilderness areas).

Absolutely true. "In GENERAL". If you don't know which forest you are in, which roads are considered "plowed", which management area you are in (wilderness, etc), then in general, the safe bet is sticking to roads and trails and the safer bet is to stick to designated roads and trails.

Very restrictive is the HMNF:

Huron Manistee National Forest:
https://www.fs.usda.gov/Internet/FSE_DOCUMENTS/stelprd3821078.pdf
Prohibited:
Using a motor vehicle, snowmobile, motorcycle, or OHV on Forest roads unless that road or portion of road is designated open to that type of vehicle.
To possess or use a motor vehicle, snowmobile, motorcycle, or OHV off Forest roads, off trail, into, across, or over forestland, wetlands, streams or beaches unless the area is designated open.

Less Restrictive is the Ottawa, but you still have to know multiple exceptions and your location:
Ottawa National Forest:
https://www.fs.usda.gov/Internet/FSE_DOCUMENTS/stelprd3833604.pdf

Snowmobiles are prohibited in designated wildernesses, Sylvania Perimeter Area, and on plowed Forest System Roads. In Semi-primitive Non-motorized Management Areas and Wild and Scenic Rivers Corridors snowmobiling is limited to designated trails.
Beginning March 1, the area of the Ottawa National Forest south of M-28 and east of Highway M-64, is closed to cross-country snowmobile use.

Hiawatha has nothing posted for reference other than their 2006 forest plan.
Hiawatha National Forest

https://www.fs.usda.gov/Internet/FSE_DOCUMENTS/stelprdb5106341.pdf
Forest roads within motorized ROS objectives will be open to snowmobile use unless designated closed.
Cross country snowmobile use is generally allowed within motorized ROS classes unless prohibitions or restrictions are needed for resource protection to meet management objectives.

CNNF is pretty restrictive

Chequamegon - Nicolet National Forest
https://www.fs.usda.gov/detail/cnnf/notices/?cid=STELPRDB5182020
Using a snowmobile on National Forest System roads unless such road is unplowed and has a snow accumulation exceeding four inches is prohibited. 36 CFR 261.54(a).
Using snowmobile on a National Forest System trail is prohibited unless designated 'open" for such use by posting.
It is prohibited to possess or use a motor vehicle off National Forest System roads. (cross country travel)

Superior is fairly restrictive (lots of "which area are you in" caveats):

Superior National Forest
https://www.fs.usda.gov/Internet/FSE_DOCUMENTS/stelprdb5111683.pdf
It is prohibited to use a snowmobile on unplowed Forest System roads within the following management areas: Semi-primitive non-motorized Recreation; Research Natural Areas; Candidate Research Natural Areas; Unique Biological Areas; and wild segments of Eligible Wild, Scenic, and Recreational Rivers.
It is prohibited to use snowmobiles on any plowed National Forest System road, except those listed in Exhibit A and shown on Exhibits B-1, C and D.
It is prohibited to possess or use a snowmobile off National Forest System roads within the following management areas: Semi-primitive non-motorized Recreation; Research Natural Areas; Candidate Research Natural Areas; Unique Biological Areas; and wild segments of Eligible Wild, Scenic, and Recreational Rivers.

 

[2TrakR]

To further explain, here's the Ottawa National Forest broken out by management areas with the snow trail overlaid on top. This does not show all of the non-national forest areas (ie private) within the boundary and is intended to show where restrictions are in place.

Green has the least restrictions.
Red is no-go.
Blue is "probably no go" in that it is managed for minimum, but is not officially considered non-motorized at this point.
The map also does not show the "no off trail in March" area.

Clearly there are not "nearly a million acres of boondocking opportunities".

 

[DamageInc]

Absolutely true. "In GENERAL". If you don't know which forest you are in, which roads are considered "plowed", which management area you are in (wilderness, etc), then in general, the safe bet is sticking to roads and trails and the safer bet is to stick to designated roads and trails.

Very restrictive is the HMNF:

Huron Manistee National Forest:
https://www.fs.usda.gov/Internet/FSE_DOCUMENTS/stelprd3821078.pdf
Prohibited:
Using a motor vehicle, snowmobile, motorcycle, or OHV on Forest roads unless that road or portion of road is designated open to that type of vehicle.
To possess or use a motor vehicle, snowmobile, motorcycle, or OHV off Forest roads, off trail, into, across, or over forestland, wetlands, streams or beaches unless the area is designated open.

Less Restrictive is the Ottawa, but you still have to know multiple exceptions and your location:
Ottawa National Forest:
https://www.fs.usda.gov/Internet/FSE_DOCUMENTS/stelprd3833604.pdf

Snowmobiles are prohibited in designated wildernesses, Sylvania Perimeter Area, and on plowed Forest System Roads. In Semi-primitive Non-motorized Management Areas and Wild and Scenic Rivers Corridors snowmobiling is limited to designated trails.
Beginning March 1, the area of the Ottawa National Forest south of M-28 and east of Highway M-64, is closed to cross-country snowmobile use.

Hiawatha has nothing posted for reference other than their 2006 forest plan.
Hiawatha National Forest

https://www.fs.usda.gov/Internet/FSE_DOCUMENTS/stelprdb5106341.pdf
Forest roads within motorized ROS objectives will be open to snowmobile use unless designated closed.
Cross country snowmobile use is generally allowed within motorized ROS classes unless prohibitions or restrictions are needed for resource protection to meet management objectives.

CNNF is pretty restrictive

Chequamegon - Nicolet National Forest
https://www.fs.usda.gov/detail/cnnf/notices/?cid=STELPRDB5182020
Using a snowmobile on National Forest System roads unless such road is unplowed and has a snow accumulation exceeding four inches is prohibited. 36 CFR 261.54(a).
Using snowmobile on a National Forest System trail is prohibited unless designated 'open" for such use by posting.
It is prohibited to possess or use a motor vehicle off National Forest System roads. (cross country travel)

Superior is fairly restrictive (lots of "which area are you in" caveats):

Superior National Forest
https://www.fs.usda.gov/Internet/FSE_DOCUMENTS/stelprdb5111683.pdf
It is prohibited to use a snowmobile on unplowed Forest System roads within the following management areas: Semi-primitive non-motorized Recreation; Research Natural Areas; Candidate Research Natural Areas; Unique Biological Areas; and wild segments of Eligible Wild, Scenic, and Recreational Rivers.
It is prohibited to use snowmobiles on any plowed National Forest System road, except those listed in Exhibit A and shown on Exhibits B-1, C and D.
It is prohibited to possess or use a snowmobile off National Forest System roads within the following management areas: Semi-primitive non-motorized Recreation; Research Natural Areas; Candidate Research Natural Areas; Unique Biological Areas; and wild segments of Eligible Wild, Scenic, and Recreational Rivers.

Since the Hiawatha and the Ottawa are the two largest national forests in the UP, and since boondocking is allowed in the MAJORITY of those forest lands, then your statement is absolutely false. Yes, a person absolutely needs to be careful where they ride (as I stated in the last post), but "in general", the majority is still open for riding.

- - - Updated - - -

To further explain, here's the Ottawa National Forest broken out by management areas with the snow trail overlaid on top. This does not show all of the non-national forest areas (ie private) within the boundary and is intended to show where restrictions are in place.

Green has the least restrictions.
Red is no-go.
Blue is "probably no go" in that it is managed for minimum, but is not officially considered non-motorized at this point.
The map also does not show the "no off trail in March" area.

Clearly there are not "nearly a million acres of boondocking opportunities".

View attachment 62319

The Ottawa NF is 990,000 acres, and the vast majority of it is open to snowmobiling. It's OK to just admit you were wrong.

 

[rp7x]

How do you know if a forest road is plowed

 

[buddah2]

How do you know if a forest road is plowed

I can't answer that question but I can add this comment: Years ago, when we first moved up here the forest roads used to be numbered up and down OR sideways...if the numbers were up & down, like you were shaking your head "yes", it was legal to ride...if the numbers were sideways, like "no", they weren't...but in their "infinite wisdom" they did away with that practice...after all, why have something anyone can understand?

 

[2TrakR]

How do you know if a forest road is plowed

While it seems like an obvious answer since most of the snow would be removed from the road, however if there's recent snow, it definitely could be hard to tell. I don't know of any enforcement actions for riding on plowed roads in the UP, I do know of enforcement actions for riding on USFS Roads in the lower peninsula.

 

[2TrakR]

Since the Hiawatha and the Ottawa are the two largest national forests in the UP, and since boondocking is allowed in the MAJORITY of those forest lands, then your statement is absolutely false. Yes, a person absolutely needs to be careful where they ride (as I stated in the last post), but "in general", the majority is still open for riding.

- - - Updated - - -



The Ottawa NF is 990,000 acres, and the vast majority of it is open to snowmobiling. It's OK to just admit you were wrong.

Alright, let's try again.

Original Post was asking for MN, WI and MI. That's 6 National Forests. 4 of the 6 prohibit cross country travel. The remaining 2 have many exceptions.
You are correct, though, the majority of the Ottawa and the Hiawatha are open to cross country travel. They are the minority of those three States.

Ottawa National Forest is:

Total Acres: 963,596.97
Closed to Cross Country Snowmobile use: 187,445.55

Break up those remaining 776,000 acres with many areas of private land and the result requires serious effort to know where you are and where you can be. It's not like there is one big block of 700K+ acres, it's a lot of disconnected areas.


This image shows the detail on USFS Ownership (green= open, red and blue = no, white is private; orange-white is snow trail).

 

[DamageInc]

Alright, let's try again.

Original Post was asking for MN, WI and MI. That's 6 National Forests. 4 of the 6 prohibit cross country travel. The remaining 2 have many exceptions.
You are correct, though, the majority of the Ottawa and the Hiawatha are open to cross country travel. They are the minority of those three States.

Ottawa National Forest is:

Total Acres: 963,596.97
Closed to Cross Country Snowmobile use: 187,445.55

Break up those remaining 776,000 acres with many areas of private land and the result requires serious effort to know where you are and where you can be. It's not like there is one big block of 700K+ acres, it's a lot of disconnected areas.


This image shows the detail on USFS Ownership (green= open, red and blue = no, white is private; orange-white is snow trail).

The forest service says it's 993,010 acres. Your numbers are bunk. The Ottawa and Watha the are by far the largest in the Yoop, and since the vast majority of that land is open to boondocking, as well as much of Superior and other small forests, your statement that boondocking is "generally prohibited" is clearly false. Buy a dictionary.

It's obvious that you have never ridden off-trail in the Ottawa, but there are maps available from the USFS if you want to learn more. https://www.fs.usda.gov/ottawa

Good day.

 

[jime]

hey guys

link to usda/ottawa -subtitle- land & resource management, has a data disclaimer as long as my arm.

 

[Tracker]

How do you know if a forest road is plowed

There is a sign at the start of each road usually right off the main one that says...this is a seasonal unplowed road....look for them....hard to see...very small....and white with red lettering

 

[DamageInc]

hey guys

link to usda/ottawa -subtitle- land & resource management, has a data disclaimer as long as my arm.

If you are implying that a person needs to be careful where they ride.....ummm, yeah, absolutely, always. That doesn't change the fact that there are massive areas in the UP where boondocking is allowed. As in: areas so huge that you can get lost and die of exposure before anyone finds you. Out west, it's even more dangerous. It's not meant for retards who can barely navigate a simple trail map.

 

[2TrakR]

There is a sign at the start of each road usually right off the main one that says...this is a seasonal unplowed road....look for them....hard to see...very small....and white with red lettering

Seasonal Road is a County Road sign. It is not a USFS road sign. Seeing that sign indicates the County claims jurisdiction of the road, but does not indicate if the USFS also claims ownership of the road (they sometimes do if the road passes through lands owned by USFS). Does not indicate if the USFS considers it an unplowed Forest Service Road.

 

[2TrakR]

The forest service says it's 993,010 acres. Your numbers are bunk. The Ottawa and Watha the are by far the largest in the Yoop, and since the vast majority of that land is open to boondocking, as well as much of Superior and other small forests, your statement that boondocking is "generally prohibited" is clearly false. Buy a dictionary.

It's obvious that you have never ridden off-trail in the Ottawa, but there are maps available from the USFS if you want to learn more. https://www.fs.usda.gov/ottawa

Good day.

Hopefully third time is the charm.

1. Please direct me to an Ottawa National Forest Map that shows cross country over-snow riding opportunities. A link will suffice.
2. My acreage calculations are based on USFS GIS data that I have, provided to me from the USFS. The numbers you are referring to, I suspect, are public "rough" numbers presented to the person maintaining a web page. There's "only" 30K difference which is a lot of land, but in this context, probably not a meaningful difference. I agree that over 900K is "nearly a million acres" but I stand by my statement that 770K open-acres is not "nearly a million acres open to cross-country travel" (it is a lot of area for certain).

3. Why do I make a generalized statement that leans towards the most-legal version of an answer to the original question? "in general cross country travel is not permitted" when referencing MI, WI and MN...

You indicated

The Ottawa NF alone has nearly a million acres of boondocking opportunities (but stay clear of the Wilderness areas).

It's a lot more than designated wilderness. If you look at a visitor map from the Ottawa, the few wilderness areas are depicted; those maps do not depict the many other areas such as Semi-Primitive Non-Motorized Areas, Wild Rivers, Special Interest Areas, etc. and all of those prohibit cross-country motorized use (over snow or not). Most people interested in off-trail riding do not know of these management areas or the restrictions in place in them and why would they since they are not on any regularly used maps.

To reinforce this point, do you recall the article from the 2019 season where off-trail riders were running on a river and had issues on Ottawa National Forest Land? Including tickets.

https://content.govdelivery.com/accounts/MIDNR/bulletins/22eaca4

Painter said the snowmobilers had ridden up the river, which is illegal under federal regulations, to do some backcountry off-trail riding. Hanson, Painter and Lopac, along with an Ontonagon County Sheriff’s deputy, were the first law enforcement officers arriving on the scene.

The area they were riding in is attached for reference. It's one of the SPNMA and no where near USFS-designated wilderness; so double jeopardy for these riders - they were on a river that was a no-no and they were then in other non-motorized areas off trail. This is not a designated wilderness. If they were going by the information "Ottawa open except for wilderness" they would have thought they were legal and that is not the case. The only legal spot they could be in that whole big section southwest of White Pine is on FSR 360 which is a dead end.

It's the same mentality for wheeled users. When MI Legislature passed PA288 to open forest roads on State Land to ORVs, all of the Facebook groups said "all snowmobile trails are now open" which is entirely not the case. A great example of the resulting fallout is the current loss of Trail 109 which was due to wheeled vehicles following the snowmobile trail and causing "damage" on private property. If you listen to one of those riders, you'll probably hear them say "well, I read all snowmobile trails are open to ORVs now plus this IS the UP, so must be OK for me to be on this one". That's like the snowmobiler who was told "all of the Ottawa is open to cross country riding except wilderness areas".

So when asked:

LEGAL off trail riding in MN, WI and MI {snip} The US Forest Service has a lot of great maps and from my understanding, State and Federal land is free game unless otherwise posted

I will answer "in general, considering the areas available to snowmobile across those three States, cross country travel is prohibited".

This is especially important when the question includes "free game unless posted". Again, look at just the Ottawa which does allow such riding and you'll find no signs designating an area closed or even open for cross country travel. Even the official Wilderness areas are poorly signed.

Is it true that cross country travel is allowed in the Ottawa and the Hiawatha? Yes.
Is it legal to do if I just watch for signs that say "no cross country travel"? No.
Is is easy to know which areas I can snowmobile cross-country in either of those National Forests? No.
Is is easy to know where I am and if I am changing into an area with different ownership or rules while riding cross-country? No.

How would I stay legal if I wanted to ride cross-country in the Ottawa National Forest? You would need to use a GPS, research each forests' rules and also where the designated management areas are, have a map that you make or shows those MAs and ownership and either pre-plan your trip or frequently stop to review the GPS.

Heck, the CNNF joins the Ottawa along the MI/WI border and have totally different rules.

Cross-country snowmobile riding is prohibited in most of MN, WI and MI. Cross-country riding in the Ottawa and Hiawatha National Forests is allowed, but doing so legally requires substantial effort on the riders part.

 

[sledjunkie25]

Thank you all for this information so far. I plan on doing more research in all these areas and printing a lot of maps. Also wondering in the three state area I mentioned, how many sled guide services are there? I know about Keweenaw Snow Expeditions but that’s the only one that I know of.

 

[katden4]

Hello all, as the season approaches I’m starting to do some research on LEGAL off trail riding in MN, WI and MI. The US Forest Service has a lot of great maps and from my understanding, State and Federal land is free game unless otherwise posted (correct me if I am wrong). I am trying to get a more clear answer on power line/high line riding and if it varies from state to state. Just trying to know before we go, we absolutely do not want to be the reason for a trail closure or even a complaint. Thanks guys.

Thank you for starting this thread! I have a feeling there will be many more people riding off trail this season, and this helps those who have not done as much of it. PLEASE everyone make sure you know what land your on! We don't want to upset what a great area we all have to ride! Its a privilege, not a right, be smart about it for all of us.