More Black Eyes on the Sport

[Braaaaaap]

Here you go, more problems for some of us to blow off. I went looking for the post from last week complaining about sledders running into or narrowly missing the groomer. There were also sledders flipping off the groomer operator. I couldn't find it but that one was in the Vilas paper.

I hadn't seen this one from January 29th.

Another trail closure

You can continue to minimalize these problems but it isn't going to change the negative trend that is happening. Anti-sled people have momentum and they are using each of these mishaps to further their cause.

And it really doesn't matter what any of our opinions are, the landowners opinion is the only one that matters.

Are you a recent transplant to the north woods? I can tell you that there is nothing new about this "negative trend". It's not a trend; it's the way it has been for decades. I've actually seen a reduction in the snowmobile drinking culture, since I started sledding in the 90s. It used to be almost universally accepted, and now many groups are "save it until after the ride". That was unheard of back then. Same for trespassing. It's not a bigger problem now than it was 10, 20, or 30 years ago, although it might seem like it to some, due to the internet or due to their youth. I do think the anti-snowmobile sentiment (among north woods locals) is stronger than ever. There are probably multiple factors with that, particularly the fact that many of them can no longer afford newer sleds (envy), and that we had a huge influx of urban tree-huggers buying northwoods property.

 

[Highflyer]

Absolutely correct. It is like everything else these days. The media gets a hold of something and beats it to death until the next thing comes along. Doesn't matter to them what it is as long as it gets views or clicks.

Right now sledding is what's being talked about by the locals. Last night at dinner I heard about trespassing, reckless riding, etc. from several people at the bar.

What most sledders don't see is what happens on the Tuesdays or Wednesdays when the locals venture out. Most locals, or full time residents avoid the weekend crush of sledders. Those that may go to bars or restaurants stay home because of the crowds.

Hell, I avoid them and I ride 2,000 plus miles a year. I don't want to listen to the loud BS, wait for tables or service.

To be honest, the only non-sledders that support us being here are those that make money off it. Most would prefer it go away.

This line is such bullshit! I love the finger pointing. Like locals don't break rules or trespass.

 

[Highflyer]

Are you a recent transplant to the north woods? I can tell you that there is nothing new about this "negative trend". It's not a trend; it's the way it has been for decades. I've actually seen a reduction in the snowmobile drinking culture, since I started sledding in the 90s. It used to be almost universally accepted, and now many groups are "save it until after the ride". That was unheard of back then. Same for trespassing. It's not a bigger problem now than it was 10, 20, or 30 years ago, although it might seem like it to some, due to the internet or due to their youth. I do think the anti-snowmobile sentiment (among north woods locals) is stronger than ever. There are probably multiple factors with that, particularly the fact that many of them can no longer afford newer sleds (envy), and that we had a huge influx of urban tree-huggers buying northwoods property.

X1000. The drinking culture has changed drastically. Nightlife is almost non-existent compared to what it was in the 80/90's. Heck, event Hurley is a small fraction of what it used to be.

What is consistent is the older riders coming on this board talking about how dangerous the weekends are, blaming the young 20's riders with MX helmets and new people to the sport. I think it comes down to it that some of you just don't have the emotional awareness to handle it.

 

[attakman]

(deleted)

 

[Highflyer]

Im all for a trial curfew for snowmobiles...1 season to see how things transpire...11pm sunday -thursday...Midnight friday & Saturday...Were doing this to ourselves with NO self control...

This might be the dumbest post of all time. A curfew really?

 

[SHOOT2KILL]

This might be the dumbest post of all time. A curfew really?

Why not...I've had one for probably 30+ seasons...No weekend riding...I ride Monday-Friday@noon...Ride from sun up to sundown...If im in the U.P. I can get 300+ mi within that timeframe...Northwoods a little less...Your welcome to try and hang with me for one of those 4 day 1200 milers...Like u told me before..."The sport has passed me by"...LOOOOL

 

[Highflyer]

Sure...there are some dumbazz locals too....but I've seen way more drunk loud mouthed FIBS through the last 35 years than I care to count....the "kiss my ass I'm on vacation " or the "you'd starve without us mentality" is a real sore spot with me

Ha yes, its now the IL people that cause all the problems. Comments like this show the "who" is just in your head to these problem. You point fingers and place blame when your truly clueless.

 

[Highflyer]

Why not...I've had one for probably 30+ seasons...No weekend riding...I ride Monday-Friday@noon...Ride from sun up to sundown...If im in the U.P. I can get 300+ mi within that timeframe...Northwoods a little less...Your welcome to try and hang with me for one of those 4 day 1200 milers...Like u told me before..."The sport has passed me by"...LOOOOL

Because having laws/rules/ordinance like this would surely lead to taking more of our freedoms away. Should we not go out in our car after 11pm as well?

 

[Tim in Indiana]

Are you a recent transplant to the north woods? I can tell you that there is nothing new about this "negative trend". It's not a trend; it's the way it has been for decades. I've actually seen a reduction in the snowmobile drinking culture, since I started sledding in the 90s. It used to be almost universally accepted, and now many groups are "save it until after the ride". That was unheard of back then. Same for trespassing. It's not a bigger problem now than it was 10, 20, or 30 years ago, although it might seem like it to some, due to the internet or due to their youth. I do think the anti-snowmobile sentiment (among north woods locals) is stronger than ever. There are probably multiple factors with that, particularly the fact that many of them can no longer afford newer sleds (envy), and that we had a huge influx of urban tree-huggers buying northwoods property.

Yes, I guess I am. I have only been here since 2004.

Are you here or do you live somewhere south and only come here to play?

I am not saying anything is new or worse. I remember well how it used to be and it was worse. But you, like a few others are missing the point of this thread. It has always gone on but now it is more visible and people care. And these people are not the type that simply accept something they don't like and roll over. They work hard to make the change they want.

Oh, and since it's been here for however long it is ok? Sounds like the "we have always done it this way" mentality.

And the anti-sled sentiment is not because they can't afford new sleds. The most vocal and fervent silent sports people I know could buy handfuls of us. They buy $1-$2 million dollar "cabins" which they visit once in a while. They are not lacking in money.

 

[Highflyer]

And it is this minority that is usually behind changes that affect the majority. Remember the old saying, "one bad apple...."

You will never change this minority. You have to find other solutions to make the problem go away. Its why I push back on posters like you who just point out who you think the problem ones are. Those problem ones will always exist so you have to find other solutions that don't involve the emotionally driven ideas that this board produces: Physical confrontation, send $100 checks to the LEO and more enforcement.

 

[SHOOT2KILL]

Because having laws/rules/ordinance like this would surely lead to taking more of our freedoms away. Should we not go out in our car after 11pm as well?

NOT if your DRUNK...When I lived in Elmhurst,il we had DUI road block checkpoints at all 4 corners of the town on sporadic weekends...It was an absolute NO NONSENCE police force when it came to keeping us safe in our million dollar homes...

 

[Tim in Indiana]

This line is such bullshit! I love the finger pointing. Like locals don't break rules or trespass.

What is BS, that many locals don't want to fight the crowds? Or that locals don't break rules?

If it is "locals don't break rules" show me where I said that in my post.

That is your statement, not mine.

 

[Tim in Indiana]

You will never change this minority. You have to find other solutions to make the problem go away. Its why I push back on posters like you who just point out who you think the problem ones are. Those problem ones will always exist so you have to find other solutions that don't involve the emotionally driven ideas that this board produces: Physical confrontation, send $100 checks to the LEO and more enforcement.

I agree, you'll never eliminate the bad eggs. There will always be some. That's why there needs to be more enforcement and higher fines for infractions. It's pretty simple, allow a bad behavior and you will get more of it.

I am trying understand where you and I disagree. Do you think trespassing off trail, loud pipes, drunk riding, etc. are not the problem ones?

And again, I have never said a "who" in the sense of a certain group. Age, location, etc. I'm sure offenders come from everywhere, including here.

Give us your ideas, please.

 

[Highflyer]

What is BS, that many locals don't want to fight the crowds? Or that locals don't break rules?

If it is "locals don't break rules" show me where I said that in my post.

That is your statement, not mine.

That' locals don't break the rules.....but I misread your post a bit.

 

[Braaaaaap]

Yes, I guess I am. I have only been here since 2004.

Are you here or do you live somewhere south and only come here to play?

I am not saying anything is new or worse. I remember well how it used to be and it was worse. But you, like a few others are missing the point of this thread. It has always gone on but now it is more visible and people care. And these people are not the type that simply accept something they don't like and roll over. They work hard to make the change they want.

Oh, and since it's been here for however long it is ok? Sounds like the "we have always done it this way" mentality.

And the anti-sled sentiment is not because they can't afford new sleds. The most vocal and fervent silent sports people I know could buy handfuls of us. They buy $1-$2 million dollar "cabins" which they visit once in a while. They are not lacking in money.

Those rich people in the north woods are in the minority. The majority are getting more poor all the time, and can no longer afford the new sleds like they could 20 years ago (especially in the UP). Yeah, that causes envy, when those people see tourists having fun on their new sleds.

No, I didn't say any of it is OK, so don't put words in my mouth. I was just pointing out that it's not some a new trend; it's the way it's always been. You called it a trend.

 

[Braaaaaap]

Why not...I've had one for probably 30+ seasons...No weekend riding...I ride Monday-Friday@noon...Ride from sun up to sundown...If im in the U.P. I can get 300+ mi within that timeframe...Northwoods a little less...Your welcome to try and hang with me for one of those 4 day 1200 milers...Like u told me before..."The sport has passed me by"...LOOOOL

Why not? Are you serious? Try reading the Bill of Rights some time. While you're at it, read the WI law that specifically outlaws those DUI checkpoints. Plesae keep your fascist laws in Illinois; we don't want them up here.

 

[Highflyer]

I agree, you'll never eliminate the bad eggs. There will always be some. That's why there needs to be more enforcement and higher fines for infractions. It's pretty simple, allow a bad behavior and you will get more of it.

I am trying understand where you and I disagree. Do you think trespassing off trail, loud pipes, drunk riding, etc. are not the problem ones?

And again, I have never said a "who" in the sense of a certain group. Age, location, etc. I'm sure offenders come from everywhere, including here.

Give us your ideas, please.

I mostly disagree with those posters that place blame on people solely from out of town and/or the younger riders. Nor do I think its nearly as bad as some of the "alarmist" on this site such as the OP who is a newer member with very few post yet felt the need to start a thread about "Another Black Eye on the Sport".

I think off trail in Wisconsin is a bad idea and have no use for loud pipes. As for drinking, I think that has gotten significantly better in Wisconsin. Additionally most snowmobile accidents that involve drinking just kill the driver. Rarely do we have those head on accidents like the one that just happened up there. Posts/posters (like shoot2kill) I feel are more afraid of what might happen versus what is actually happening 99% of the time. Every year in Wisconsin 15-30 people die on sleds yet we still have posters shocked that it happens. Snowmobiling is a dangerous hobby and if can't handle that then maybe you shouldn't be riding.

As for ideas, I could name a few but it wouldn't be constructive in this thread.

 

[Highflyer]

Why not? Are you serious? Try reading the Bill of Rights some time. While you're at it, read the WI law that specifically outlaws those DUI checkpoints. Plesae keep your fascist laws in Illinois; we don't want them up here.

Your post brings up another great point. Tim from Indiana and Shot2kill from IL think the state of Wisconsin needs more enforcement. I'm not sure the residents in the Northwoods want more enforcement for any of the laws.....

Who said the Californian people moving out of state are ruining things in other states????

 

[attakman]

(deleted)

 

[whitedust]

I might carry a Glock 9 in my left pocket...i ride solo most of the time...If some out of control Ricky Racer drives their sled on MY side of the trail and physically hurts me (I dont care about the sled damage) in an accident .I hope I have the restraint not to SHOOT2KILL...

Really??????