New Polaris Patriot 850!!!

[POLARISDAN]

since u guys are my bro's..will u please explain why its on an indy frame and why is that appealing?..isnt that like the basic package? why wouldnt it be on the axys or something like that?

also slim..what is this DI they are talking about on the other thread? im so friggin clueless..turn on and go as u kno

 

[jetrep]

since u guys are my bro's..will u please explain why its on an indy frame and why is that appealing?..isnt that like the basic package? why wouldnt it be on the axys or something like that?

also slim..what is this DI they are talking about on the other thread? im so friggin clueless..turn on and go as u kno

As far as I can gather there's no such thing as an "Indy frame". The current Indy up til now was on the PRO-RIDE chassis.

Think of Axys as the front half of the sled. For example, the Pro-S is on the Axys chassis with Pro-XC suspension.

The new Indy XC is the Axys chassis with Pro-CC suspension.

 

[slimcake]

since u guys are my bro's..will u please explain why its on an indy frame and why is that appealing?..isnt that like the basic package? why wouldnt it be on the axys or something like that?

also slim..what is this DI they are talking about on the other thread? im so friggin clueless..turn on and go as u kno

All good PD. Like was said up until now the indy was like your 600 I just helped with. Pro R front end. Now the Indy has the Axys front end which is a big improvement. The conventional tunnel in a 129" track fits in the line up real nice. Some peeps wouldn't buy the "hay baler" look that is the Pro S/x XCR with that style suspension. So now they have something to fill that hole. DI means direct fuel injection. Which means it squirts the fuel directly into the combustion chamber rather than into say the throttle body or intake port. I kinda like my cold fuel going through the crankcase cooling things off but the damn epa is making it hard for the manufacturers to do that any more....

 

[durphee]

Guess a question for someone who is mechanically unspecial like me is......what are pros/cons of direct inject like the ski doo. Would that be a preferred way of putting fuel into the chamber? All I know is that if the 850 Poo engine is responsive like the 850 doo engine I would be a happy camper.

 

[Yenann]

95 times out of 100, I have been impressed by what the rider makes the sled do, not the other way around.

-John

Quote of the year!!!

 

[snobuilder]

With DI the fuel never passes through the crankcase as in a conventional 2 stroke design. That is why Doo needed self-lubricating bearings on the crankshaft. These failed in the first versions of the DI motors.
Hard to think of gas as a lubricant, but with the oil mix, it is enough to make things slippery enough in a 2 stroke bottom end.

I think the newer versions of the Poo 800 and now 850 directly add oil to crucial points and so far has proven to be a winner on the 800 HO and hopefully in the new 850.....oil is cheap compared to a rebuild.

 

[1fujifilm]

Guess a question for someone who is mechanically unspecial like me is......what are pros/cons of direct inject like the ski doo. Would that be a preferred way of putting fuel into the chamber? All I know is that if the 850 Poo engine is responsive like the 850 doo engine I would be a happy camper.

Right on Durphee.
Let's do a comparison, when you get the new 850 Polaris next year we can switch sleds and do a test of the two back to back; say from the Rousseau Bar.

Bear

 

[old abe]

Doo's SDI engines were designed so the fuel was injected into the transfer passages just prior to the intake cylinder port. No fuel in the crankcase. I have 2 Doo 600SDI's, with 20K plus combined miles, and have never touched either. I know of several 600 SDI Doo's that each went over 20K without being touched. How ever the DI, ETech is a much more efficient, precise way to inject the fuel for better performance, and fuel economy. Not bragging, just my experience. The sealed/iso grease bearings, started in 1999, with the first cylinder reed small block 600, as a carburetor engine. Perhaps thus knowing the SDI engines were coming in a few years.

 

[snobuilder]

Doo's SDI engines were designed so the fuel was injected into the transfer passages just prior to the intake cylinder port. No fuel in the crankcase. I have 2 Doo 600SDI's, with 20K plus combined miles, and have never touched either. I know of several 600 SDI Doo's that each went over 20K without being touched. How ever the DI, ETech is a much more efficient, precise way to inject the fuel for better performance, and fuel economy. Not bragging, just my experience. The sealed/iso grease bearings, started in 1999, with the first cylinder reed small block 600, as a carburetor engine. Perhaps thus knowing the SDI engines were coming in a few years.

Interesting.
Those miles are impressive......mostly hear of blow ups when they happen.....probly many more successful high mileage Doos than blowed up ones,...eh?

 

[old abe]

Interesting.
Those miles are impressive......mostly hear of blow ups when they happen.....probly many more successful high mileage Doos than blowed up ones,...eh?

snobuilder we have had good results with our Doo's over the years. We had good results with our Poo's also. We try to provide the best care of them as we ride some long, and remote area trips. 2 engine failures on our Doo's. One a 98 670, 13K miles, and a plastic cage crank bearing gave up out west. My son still has it with many more miles since. I had a 02 700, and a rod bearing got loose on the crank. We were on a Minne/Wis trip with friends. It started with a knocking noise at certain RPM's. Finally stopped in Manitowish, Wi., and a rental dealer confirmed what was the problem, and told us to continue our trip. 600 plus miles more, and it didn't get any worse. I can tell you though I had a puckered butt the whole time!!! Doo replaced the bottom end with a new 1 year warranty. 2 years later it developed ECM issues, and I traded for a 2005 Rev/Rene 600 SDI, one we still have for the kids. I provide the sleds if you know what I mean, and that is fine.

 

[Tracker]

question old abe.....are those miles easy trail miles at 50....or hard driving trails miles on moguls and rough terrain and long stretches of grade....I would guess very easy miles on both sleds by all riders.....no?

 

[momoney2123]

Guess a question for someone who is mechanically unspecial like me is......what are pros/cons of direct inject like the ski doo. Would that be a preferred way of putting fuel into the chamber? All I know is that if the 850 Poo engine is responsive like the 850 doo engine I would be a happy camper.

Going by this article the only reason all manufacutres arent doing DI... is money.......SDI is no doubt less complex and less expensive...which has its pros and cons


http://cs.amsnow.com/sno/b/sno/archive/2015/05/18/is-direct-injection-the-answer.aspx

 

[old abe]

question old abe.....are those miles easy trail miles at 50....or hard driving trails miles on moguls and rough terrain and long stretches of grade....I would guess very easy miles on both sleds by all riders.....no?

Our sleds are everything/whatever miles. Home/farm field/trail, long haul Canadian trips, Wyo/Ida, Wis, Minn, UP. We just ride however as we need or want. I don't ride as hard as I did when younger, and enjoy that. That is taken care of by my son, and his wife. We are not constantly beating the crap out of them, no. We try to take good care of them also. The 2, 20K mile SDI's we came across, were in South Range, UP. Seen another at the Doo dealer in Houghton. They were not beat up looking either.

 

[old abe]

Going by this article the only reason all manufacutres arent doing DI... is money.......SDI is no doubt less complex and less expensive...which has its pros and cons


http://cs.amsnow.com/sno/b/sno/archive/2015/05/18/is-direct-injection-the-answer.aspx

That article is right on fuji. Evinrude was working on several different, combinations of, and Etech, of DI when purchased by Bombardier. The Etech was the end result of the development process. It is more expensive, but much more precise, and adapted to more situations, such as the cold climate uses. Military applications included, as with different fuels able to be used. The Doo SDI injection system, is more precise in fuel placemant than the AC Ctec, and Poo's CFI. As it injects the fuel in the transfer passage/passages just prior to the intake cylinder port, no fuel into the crankcase. Thus better fuel economy, and combustion efficiency. AC, and Poo's are designed different for their own purposes/reasons, and less expensive. Both have fuel in the crankcase.

 

[srt20]

That article is right on fuji. Evinrude was working on several different, combinations of, and Etech, of DI when purchased by Bombardier. The Etech was the end result of the development process. It is more expensive, but much more precise, and adapted to more situations, such as the cold climate uses. Military applications included, as with different fuels able to be used. The Doo SDI injection system, is more precise in fuel placemant than the AC Ctec, and Poo's CFI. As it injects the fuel in the transfer passage/passages just prior to the intake cylinder port, no fuel into the crankcase. Thus better fuel economy, and combustion efficiency. AC, and Poo's are designed different for their own purposes/reasons, and less expensive. Both have fuel in the crankcase.

Poo 2 injector cfi has no fuel in crankcase.

IIRC Cats/Suzuki EFI had injectors right after throttle bodies? And IMO is much preferred.

 

[Tracker]

Poo 2 injector cfi has no fuel in crankcase.

IIRC Cats/Suzuki EFI had injectors right after throttle bodies? And IMO is much preferred.

and the truth shall set you free.....X2

 

[old abe]

Poo 2 injector cfi has no fuel in crankcase.

IIRC Cats/Suzuki EFI had injectors right after throttle bodies? And IMO is much preferred.

Okay, I stand corrected on Poo CFI. Is there more than one design Poo CFI engines have used???

 

[yamadooed]

That article is right on fuji. Evinrude was working on several different, combinations of, and Etech, of DI when purchased by Bombardier. The Etech was the end result of the development process. It is more expensive, but much more precise, and adapted to more situations, such as the cold climate uses. Military applications included, as with different fuels able to be used. The Doo SDI injection system, is more precise in fuel placemant than the AC Ctec, and Poo's CFI. As it injects the fuel in the transfer passage/passages just prior to the intake cylinder port, no fuel into the crankcase. Thus better fuel economy, and combustion efficiency. AC, and Poo's are designed different for their own purposes/reasons, and less expensive. Both have fuel in the crankcase.

Abe they weren't just working on it OMC was putting it in OB motors under the guise of FICHT this is way back in the 90s this evolved into the Etec we is see'n today... This technology was all thanks to those darn enviromentals and their list for emmissions...

 

[srt20]

Okay, I stand corrected on Poo CFI. Is there more than one design Poo CFI engines have used???

The CFI 2 has 2 injectors in transfer ports, like doo SDI.

The CFI 4 had 2 injectors in the transfer ports, just like doo SDI, and 2 injectors in the bottom.

They also had a 2+2 CFI for a year or 2. Never worked on one, but I am assuming the injectors are in the same location as the CFI 4, just with different mapping for the injector pulses.

IDK what the fusion 900 or 700 had. They are junk and should all be recycled.

BTW, my riding bud has a turbo on his 2013 poo 800. It uses the stock injectors, along with extra injectors in the intake BEFORE the throttle bodies. IMO this is the best of the best. The reeds are cooled by fuel, the entire crankcase, wrist pins, bearings, etc, are cooled by fuel. His entire engine top to bottom is in fantastic condition. It has 2000 HARD turbo Mountain miles, running 10+psi of boost with 13.1 compression. ~200-210 horsepower.

 

[old abe]

The CFI 2 has 2 injectors in transfer ports, like doo SDI.

The CFI 4 had 2 injectors in the transfer ports, just like doo SDI, and 2 injectors in the bottom.

They also had a 2+2 CFI for a year or 2. Never worked on one, but I am assuming the injectors are in the same location as the CFI 4, just with different mapping for the injector pulses.

IDK what the fusion 900 or 700 had. They are junk and should all be recycled.

BTW, my riding bud has a turbo on his 2013 poo 800. It uses the stock injectors, along with extra injectors in the intake BEFORE the throttle bodies. IMO this is the best of the best. The reeds are cooled by fuel, the entire crankcase, wrist pins, bearings, etc, are cooled by fuel. His entire engine top to bottom is in fantastic condition. It has 2000 HARD turbo Mountain miles, running 10+psi of boost with 13.1 compression. ~200-210 horsepower.

srt20;You have jogged my memory somewhat. I do now remember something of a back and forth different CFI 600 injection systems. As I remember only on the 600??? Then Poo brought out a completely new 600, crank, lower cases, ect, with the present CFI system??? Still using this engine presently???