Huh? I never said anything about a Shift?
No INDY 600 136" in the Polaris lineup for '13.......what's up with that??
- Thread starter rakins800
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Huh? I never said anything about a Shift?
Yep
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Other than the old IQ 550 fan Shift, the new Indy 600 is the new Shift. I should have been more clear, but the Indy 600/Shift are now the same thing.
I don't think that at all!! The 2013 Indy 600 is a much better speced sled than the Shift in every way. The market for the 2013 Indy is entry level & fills that niche very well & better than others.IMO Poo dealers will need to ask more questions of the Faithful not make sled choice based on price only. As far as Poo trail sleds Rush is the banger sled & Adventure is the high mileage cruiser sled although a 2s so won't last as long as 4s high mileage cruisers. Poo weak here on 4s.IMO Shift is only a 550s fan & on way out due to EPA requirements. Seems to me most sledders these days are hardcore riders & want all of the best sled & engine features. Indy will be a very nice rental sled & if there are people out there that want to enter the sport based on price Indy 600 is meant for them. Affordable new sleds are a good thing but many snowless & warm winters has to make a new rider think long & hard about the money it takes to be a sled owner. SUV ,Truck, Trailer, gas room & board costs are going to overwhelm many younger people so I'm not sure any entry level sled will sell like hotcakes. The market is shrinking plain & simple & lots of non current sleds to sell too that will see big discounts so lots to consider buying any sled.
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The base Indy 600 is very much like the Shift, less options than the Indy 600 SP. The main differences are no handelbar hooks, Ryde FX shocks vs. Fox, standard ski vs. the new Pro steer ski and the track has a .91" lug vs. 1" on the SP and $1,000 less. So yes, it is very much like the last Shift 600. They both even have manual gas gauges. I agree, there will be tons of these as rental sleds, but the base Indy 600 is nothing more than a Shift with a Rush front end. Nothing wrong with that, I think that's a great thing and I think we will see lots of these on the trails next year, IMO.
Tell me how the base Indy 600 is better spec'd in every way than the Shift. I don't see it!
Tell me how the base Indy 600 is better spec'd in every way than the Shift. I don't see it!
2013 Indy is a new pro ride 1 piece 121 glued platform Shift was not it was a strip IQ. Indy SP is a decent sled spec wise & probably sell more of those than plain Jane Indy for 1st time buyer that does his/her homework. 1st year Shift thumb warmer was an option & graphics were options could go plain black no wrapper & Shift backed into the price point market by stripping it to a cheapo sled it was not created for the market it came thru the back door. Now let's look back 15-20 years to the history of the Indy & what that name means to people. Back in the 90s the Indy Trail or Trail Deluxe was a good looking green sled with 488 fan or you could buy the 488 liquid both engines were bullet proof unbeatable bang for buck entry level sleds that became legacy products for Poo & Poo was clearly in #1 market position. Poo then evolved to the triples & IMO got mired in too many platforms with the wedge still the best handling platform for them for 10 years or so. Sad but true. Poo seemed lost in new sled design for years no focus at all then released vibrating 755 & 900 engines with the ultimate stinker the Fusion 900. Poo slipped to #3 maybe #4 for 2 -3 years or more discountined the 755 & 900 evolved thru a darn good 700 twin engine with the Dragon & lost many users on the way down with lost market share & too many bad sleds & engines. The big dog 800 cc 2s engine has ALWAYS been a problem for Poo. Beats me why???.... very difficult for Poo. Poo 600 & 700s have ALWAYS been very good engines for them. Then Pro Ride leading edge glued platform was released in the Rush for the trail bangers & evolved to the entire lineup in 2012. Poo now is fighting back for #2 market position but still #3 but doing much better than the dismal prior years before Pro ride. So in 2013 Poo needs a kicker something fresh to get back lost market share & creates a price point sled with a new 1 piece Pro Ride platform with a bullet proof 600 2s engine & the Indy SP is = to the old Indy Deluxe in many ways not only the name. The buyers will define if the Indy SP is also a Poo legacy product or just a renamed Shift as you suggest. The 2013 Indy does not appeal to me in anyway as I want more HP & 144 maybe 136 track high milage crossover sled much like the 4s AC 2013 Cross Tour Turbo. So the question in my mind will the newbies buy the Indy looks like a good sled bang for the buck? To me so many things have changed in 20 years that support snowmobiling. SUVs & trucks have been replaced by gas miser cars that can not tow trailers so you may have to buy a truck, trailer & 2 sleds at about $75K to own & use 2 sleds. Are there many newbies that have that type of cash to start snowmobiling for a 90 day winter recreation? I don't think so used everything is the best market for newbie snowmobilers with renting at top of list for 90 days sport. All IMO.
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Come on whitedust, let's not state the obvious. I know the 2013 is the Pro Ride etc. blah, blah, blah! Let's not go back to the first year of the Shift, we are talking about last year's Shift 600. The chassis has changed for the better, but the marketing idea is the same; an affordable entry sled with one of the most reliable 600's ever built. You don't think the Indy 600 is a stripped Pro Ride? You get so far off track sometimes it's blows my mind!
You're right about the Indy in the 90's, it accounted for 50% of all sled sales. Still haven't seen any facts that Poo is 3rd in market share in 2012 model sales. Can you point me to where you have found that information? I don't think any OEM has been #4, as you suggest maybe Polaris was, except Yamaha. Yamaha keeps losing market share and does nothing but BNG's again this year! Oh wait, they came out with a 120. They made a huge blunder betting everything on 4 strokes and not offering any 2 strokes! Sleds are not motorcycles!
You're right about the Indy in the 90's, it accounted for 50% of all sled sales. Still haven't seen any facts that Poo is 3rd in market share in 2012 model sales. Can you point me to where you have found that information? I don't think any OEM has been #4, as you suggest maybe Polaris was, except Yamaha. Yamaha keeps losing market share and does nothing but BNG's again this year! Oh wait, they came out with a 120. They made a huge blunder betting everything on 4 strokes and not offering any 2 strokes! Sleds are not motorcycles!
Mark you ask a question of me & I give you a complete answer easy & as simple as that. All the mags have Poo 3 AC 2 nip & tuck if they are wrong then they are wrong but that is where I get the market info don't shoot the messenger. I'm not going to look up page & sentence number you just need to accept the data or reject it but would be better if you had an open mind about market share position. I never compared sleds to motorcycles you did so let's be clear about that. What does Yamaha 2013 line up have to do with 2013 Indy? Sure I favor 4s engines over 2s any brand but always buy best widget for the buck & tech. I 1st bought Poos then Cat many Doos now have a Yamaha. I am NOT brand loyal in anyway with anything as tech changes I'm on top of it right now AC Cross Tour Turbo would be best sled for me. You seem ultra defensive of Poo in every way which is Ok I guess just not the way I think & that is where we part in logic as brand is a moving target to me every year. Sorry but just not my style to think brand 1st tech is much more important to me. Since you brought it up 100% agree 2013 Yamaha line up is old in the tooth & AC doing things that are right for me in past 2 years. Yamaha IMO is looking for a way out of sled biz maybe sell engines to Cat in near future. Just for the record AC is manufacturing SRT for Yamaha in 2013 more industry changes & partnerships. Yam can't keep offering same old same old since 2006 & exspect to keep market share just won't work in long term. Again answers to your questions & if you have additional questions I'll do my best to provide answers.
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I only get 2 snowmobile magazines, Snow Goer and American Snowmobiler. I read them both cover to cover and can't find where they give market share for 2012. Must be the same page that says Ski Doo has 60% of the market! What's 20% one way or the other, right? I never said you compared sleds to cycles, just stating the mistake Yamaha has made. I'm no more defensive of Poo than you have been of Yamaha, until lately. You must not want to be a part of a sinking ship. To say you haven't been brand loyal until recently is kind of funny.
What's 20% one way or the other, right? I never said you compared sleds to cycles, just stating the mistake Yamaha has made. I'm no more defensive of Poo than you have been of Yamaha, until lately. You must not want to be a part of a sinking ship. To say you haven't been brand loyal until recently is kind of funny.I only get 2 snowmobile magazines, Snow Goer and American Snowmobiler. I read them both cover to cover and can't find where they give market share for 2012. Must be the same page that says Ski Doo has 60% of the market!
If you want to go back 2-3 years ago yes I liked Yamaha a lot but just not keeping up much the same as past Poo blunders when they lost market share too. Where would you like to place Poo in market share & why since you object to close 2 but still 3? Yamaha Corp far from sinking ship just will not retool snowmobile line up for next next generation which indicates to me that Yam may be done in this market. Which is AOk with me since AC & Doo make good 4s doo a bit short in 4s HP for me but AC has too much HP I don't need 170HP but 125 too little so I'll take 170 HP as always buy top of line product. Poo does not have a good 4s product for me so not in running. Another side note for you AC claims to be #1 in 4s sales in 2012 so must be a real 4s market out there & growing. To me every 2s engine burn down breeds another 4s user. For me I just got tired of all the 2s engine problems so bought a 4s & really no comparison in engine reliability just gas & go.