Polaris moving some work to Mexico....

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booondocker

New member
Actually, I disagree....you can call them on it.

The pen is mightier than the sword.

I don't know what they sell...nor do I care, but they all sell something. And if you wrote to the board of directors and explained that you USED to buy their widgets, but because they have decided to slather bonuses to the CEO, and moved operations out of the country that YOU NO LONGER WILL BUY THAT WIDGET FROM THEM.

If enough people boycott their stuff....they will reform. This has been true for many years. It works, is quite effective and is NOT something they want to deal with.

Pressure from the consumer is not easy to handle....but this requires something more than a bit of apathy....you must follow through.

I have written many advertisers on TV who support anti war movements, or other vocal programs that are way off base....and I have gotten many letters back from the PR department. Some are real replies, and others are just canned crap that means nothing....but in NUMBERS this can be very effective, and it will work.

Remember, if you don't buy it...that's okay. But if you don't buy it because of &&**(&)(*&)%^%&, and you tell them that, you will bring about change.

We just have to wake up to these facts, and exercise our rights and freedoms and TRUST that the rest will take care of itself. Hat's off to Minard's for trying that campaign...if they do it more and more, it means it is working...but if you walk into the store and say, "you know...I like the fact that you have many American Made products....directly spoken to someone above the cash register clerk. Doing that sends a message, loud and clear.

Coming from Car Country....I am surprised that someone like Chrysler doesn't start using this process in their advertisements, specifying that 90% of the car parts and assembly is USA.

This would be an effective advertisement that a whole bunch of people would respond to.

Generous Motors is still living with the Government bail out that got a whole bunch of loyal folks up tight about. Ford has benefited from that process and FORD knows it. In numbers the whole world can change if enough get together and vocalize this stuff.
 
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whitedust

Well-known member
CEOs do the thinking & planning they want you to work & add value. In a nutshell help or get out of the way & no they don't give a rats Azz about how you feel you are just a worker bee that can be replaced. Biz is biz hard & cold no room for emotion take no prisoners just slow you down from the objective. Once you understand the cold way of it you only have so long at this or that job & time to move on....add value some where else for more money. 40 years at 1 place & the goldwatch just not going to happen. Also reason Board of Directors does not promote from within they want new blood with new ideas not same old same old that got them to current place & time. Board of Directors see current management as part of the problem or they would not have these problems. Are you getting this yet see how they think?
 
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whitedust

Well-known member
Ok... Why not play their game & make money at it too makes my day. CEOs are King until they bring in another King. lol
 
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frnash

Active member
booondocker said:
… if you wrote to the board of directors and explained that you USED to buy their widgets, but because they have decided to slather bonuses to the CEO, and moved operations out of the country that YOU NO LONGER WILL BUY THAT WIDGET FROM THEM.

If enough people boycott their stuff....they will reform. This has been true for many years. It works, is quite effective and is NOT something they want to deal with. …
Click to expand...
That plan may work, at least until the growing global market far exceeds the domestic market (if that's not already the case). Once that point is reached, they might conclude that … "the domestic market is just a drop in the ocean, and a few disgruntled domestic customers are irrelevant; we've got bigger fish to fry!"
 
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whitedust

Well-known member
frnash said:
That plan may work, at least until the growing global market far exceeds the domestic market (if that's not already the case). Once that point is reached, they might conclude that … "the domestic market is just a drop in the ocean, and a few disgruntled domestic customers are irrelevant; we've got bigger fish to fry!"
Click to expand...

USA no longer the locomotive of the world economy more like the caboose. Emerging markets is what every CEO is concentrating on & where the real incremental growth dwells.What will make Coke grow in USA outside of population growth & arm wrestle a little market share from Pepsi? Answer is nothing just run usual marketing ads & who cares. On the other hand if all the Chinese & Indians choose Coke over Pepsi you just doubled or tripled the size of you company with real incremental growth. Now where are you going to concentrate your efforts emerging markets of course. Don't get me wrong USA market is huge for softdrinks but world's emerging markets is what CEOs lose sleep over. Lose emerging markets & you lose big simple as that. I find emerging markets very exciting USA same old same old huge but not low hanging fruit like emerging markets.You want to boycott Coke/Pepsi products because you are pissed about this or that will just give them more reason to move on. All biz loses market share to competitors but then in turn Corps have to increase biz elsewhere to grow or die. Believe me CEOs know exactly where they want to concentrate there efforts & then organize & execute to get there.
 
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anonomoose

New member
We USA workers really are NOT concerned about the World Markets...we can NOT control what the Chinese, or Indian's want, or build. And I see no problems with General Motors going to china to build buicks....good for them. Just don't bring those buicks here.

What is at issue is that we are not exporting...we are importing.

Every time we go to wally world and buy a wash tub, we are supporting design and construction of that tub off shore.

If we don't buy it....I don't care who made it...they can't sell it and if they can't sell it...they will not offer it.

If two competing stores offer wash tubs, and one is made in the USA and the other is made in Pakistan....and nobody buys the product made in pakistan, then the store selling the Pakistani product will stop importing it and buy from the USA company instead.

This is NOT about selling goods abroad. IT is all about selling goods in YOUR hardware store.

WE control that by deciding to buy it, use the product, purchase their support technology...etc.

Now if there is a choice and we don't walk around like chickens without heads saying...gee whiz....I don't care...or there is nothing I can do about it...then THEY WIN....and it is hopeless.

But if enough folks decide, enough is enough...and they stand together, somebody will build those wash tubs in the USA, and they will advertise that this is a USA product, and to **** with that cheap crap that breaks the first time you put too hot of water in it, or is a cheap knock off, then we have a fighting chance.

Take a trip to Germany, and count the Hondas over there. BMWs sit in most of the driveways, and if you did dare to drive a Honda home, you would definitely hear about it from your neighbors and friends...it is peer pressure that will bring about these changes...and much of Europe knows this. Go to Japan and see how many chevys are rolling around over there. We are the stupid ones...we grab what we see and like without a thought for what it is doing to the country we are leaving are kids with.

Remember when stuff was built to last??

Kmart, was one of the first companies that I remember that said...gee whiz...we can go right to china and have them make this product and we can sell it for half the price and we will make twice as much money.

Well that worked for awhile...and we all sucked it up. We also put a spike in the heart of many USA makers doing just that.

Eventually, the crap that kmart sold was found out to be poorly made, and didn't last and people came full circle and stopped buying it.

The idiots over at kmart ignored this problem....long story short...they are now a has been history lesson.

If American companies would stop chasing their tails about emerging global markets, and pay attention to the market they have right here, and build locally, and sell locally, and build quality...people will come.

Send a branch over seas....that's fine...sell it over there too, just don't bring it back home to sell here...we don't want it.

I won't buy it here. I won't do it because I am driving a spike in the coffin of my grand kids, and they can't all be greeters at walmart...or house cleaners. There is NO job...nothing...that can't be done over seas, cheaper and faster at pennies on the dollar here. From consulting to high finance...it is moving out of here faster than a lightening strike.

So you have two choices...continue to ignore it...and then live with the inevitable consequences, or you can wise up, work with what many intelligent folks are finally figuring out and put pressure on the companies that make the stuff and let them know ...this is acceptable and THAT is not. Then our children's children will thank you for winning world war 3...an economic war that does NOT involve bullets.
 
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whitedust

Well-known member
I digress, Buy whatever you want I don't care not my money none of my biz. Yamaha, Poo, AC or Doo all good solid products so don't assume not made here is junk. You want all USA made & born here good luck with that then try & find it or better yet build it yourself.:) lol If is is a good product I buy it ....I guess I'm bad I buy Stilh weedwackers blower & chain saw don't even consider any other brand & Yes the Stilh Faimily lives in Germany & has been good to me & owns tons of land in northern WI. Maybe some day they will sell it back to us if they go broke from all these boycotts that don't happen.:) LOL. By the way Walmart took the market from Kmart beat them at the game always will be winners & losers.
 
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likinit2

New member
if they were looking to save 30 mil a year they should have outsourced the Board of Directors and kept the jobs here that helps the economy and more people in this country will be able to buy those products being made. How many Mexican workers will be buying quads in Mexico?
 
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polarisrider1

New member
likinit2 said:
if they were looking to save 30 mil a year they should have outsourced the Board of Directors and kept the jobs here that helps the economy and more people in this country will be able to buy those products being made. How many Mexican workers will be buying quads in Mexico?
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Being done, A stamping plant in Holland, Mi. Has done just that. Out with the US Board and CEO and in with a Korean Team (note the word team) and now the company is thriving. It was a last ditch effort to keep the company going and it is working. No jobs are sacred anymore. A friend that works in the plant said, "Things couldn't be better. "
 
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mjkaliszak

New member
" Take a trip to Germany, and count the Hondas over there. BMWs sit in most of the driveways, and if you did dare to drive a Honda home, you would definitely hear about it from your neighbors and friends...it is peer pressure that will bring about these changes...and much of Europe knows this. Go to Japan and see how many chevys are rolling around over there. We are the stupid ones...we grab what we see and like without a thought for what it is doing to the country we are leaving are kids with. "

I agree. We need to change our thinking , our government politicials, our corporate ceo's and their beliefs. Capitalism works if there is morals & integrity & honor at the TOP. That's what we are lacking, we need a revolution in this country.

In mexico , there is rich & poor, that's it. Soon to be that way in America. No middle class left. There should be someway to protect out country for all it's greatness & still expand in emerging markets. Have a GM product loan and then call customer service ( ALLY financial ) ? you get transferred to Malaysia. Cheap labor is king, profit above all else ? ? ? ( What about God, Family, Country ? )

I have been to Mexico , unfortunatly assisting my current employer move all US operations there. After 4 months , I told them I was done. I don't want to be apart of moving our operations out of America.... I'm waiting for the end. Kind of thought they would let me go after that but they did not. Our company treats the mexican workers worse than us. They are good humble people ( made many friends down there ) most of them have nothing or very little, the working class is poor financially. If you could only see conditions of the working class in central mexico you would be shocked. Our company pays the Mold Techs 250 peso's a day and the few supervisiors 400 peso's a day. Conversion rate is approx 12 peso's to $1. (You do the math ) Work them like dogs, and fire them after their Mexican government sponsored contract is up unless they are needed. OR sign them for a yearly contract . Lots of benefits to moving out of the USA , no heath care costs, no rules to follow, no OSHA, ect... AND the over the border locations still lose money ? Here are some pics of Torreon Mex. Here are some workers, our shiny new facility, and the inductrial complex it is in, and a local dwelling we call it a house in America. We guard & gate our facility, in a gated - guarded complex. Along with Delphi, John Deer, Johnson controls, Wrangler, we make wiring harnesses ( automotive power distribution ) that go in your FORD.

TIM ( This is Mexico ) the one that tourists seldom see.
" Hear that big sucking sound " Yet ?
 
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xcr440

Well-known member
mjkaliszak said:
I agree. We need to change our thinking , our government politicials, our corporate ceo's and their beliefs. Capitalism works if there is morals & integrity & honor at the TOP. That's what we are lacking, we need a revolution in this country.

In mexico , there is rich & poor, that's it. Soon to be that way in America. No middle class left. There should be someway to protect out country for all it's greatness & still expand in emerging markets. Have a GM product loan and then call customer service ( ALLY financial ) ? you get transferred to Malaysia. Cheap labor is king, profit above all else ? ? ? ( What about God, Family, Country ? )
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Very well said mjkaliszak. And thank you for pointing out Ford's are by NO MEANS American Made. Been this way for YEARS.

Anyone who thinks its "OK" for CEO's to collect 475X the average worker is off their rocker.

I'm all for buying the better product, but having 1% of the company workforce take 99% of the benefit is absolutely rediculous.
 
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Deleted member 10829

Guest
I don't get it, if you don't want to be a part of moving the company to Mexico, why don't you quit? You said you were done!
 
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whitedust

Well-known member
Also looks like a typical plant in USA. All automotive in Detroit has wire fence & security & I have been in them all. I agree your not down with company direction you are better off leaving next guy will be happy to have your job & motivated to move tech to Mexico. I would never stay in a job I don't like or feel conflicted. Just not worth it move on.
 
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polarisrider1

New member
Hey guys, don't shoot the messenger! Thank you Mike for the insight. Nothing is going to change. Was I the only one listening to H. Ross Perot? Him and Iacoca knew this was coming, no one listened, only laughed at poor little Ross. (the billionare).
 
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prowrench

New member
I must say I am very impressed with both the passion and the eloquence with which you guys are voicing your opinions and ideas on this subject. Makes me feel slightly better about the percentage of people around that DO care and are seemingly willing to act, I say in my $210 USA made Red Wings. We must ACT! ACT ACT ACT!
Thanks.
P.S. Rain Sucks
 
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mjkaliszak

New member
That was " Done Traveling back & forth to MEX ". In a nut shell, I live outside of Kalamazoo, jobs are tough to come by. I live 2.5 miles from my place of employment, I agreed to stay to the end of the location transfer due to my position . The next job may require a lenghty drive, and with having kids going to college this up coming year, I want to stay at my salary level & convenient location as long as possible..... To be honest I don't know what is best......, I expected to be issued my WARN act notification as soon as I said I was done with MEX. The company can't make you leave the country, I did initially want the international experience, however after 4 months of back n forth , with no worthy compensation for my commitment it was not worth it ( IMO for me & my family ) I had reviewed all my lost family time and added household expense from being away from my house and determined it was not worth it. It is not what I believe in, and eventually told the company that no amount of money was worth my lost time with my kids growing up. For reference I crunched numbers, salary, bonus, ect... I made $6.25 an hour for (my time) in another country when not at work in the Torreon facility. ( Embarassing to admit ) but that was all I recieved . I had gotten sick of being taken advantage of by my company. I still try to do A Good job, that;s WHY my company pays me. BUT ... I don't have to agree.
 
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whitedust

Well-known member
Objection to international travel is understandable I have drawn that line myself not how I want to live as a family man. I need to be home at least on weekends for my family & proper parenting for kids. Too me international travel better suited to the single person. I still don't think I could carry on if conflicted with company goals my heart just would not be in it & I would move on. I have passed up many jobs because I don't want to represent a certain company or product. But if works for you in exchange for money you will do what you have to do to survive. Good luck. :)
 
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xcsp

Member
Came across the following info on another forum........

19 Facts About The Deindustrialization Of America
Author Unknown
12-17-10

The United States is rapidly becoming the very first "post-industrial" nation on the globe.

All great economic empires eventually become fat and lazy and squander the great wealth that their forefathers have left them, but the pace at which America is accomplishing this is absolutely amazing. It was America that was at the forefront of the industrial revolution. It was America that showed the world how to mass produce everything from automobiles to televisions to airplanes. It was the great American manufacturing base that crushed Germany and Japan in World War II. But now we are witnessing the deindustrialization of America.

Tens of thousands of factories have left the United States in the past decade alone. Millions upon millions of manufacturing jobs have been lost in the same time period. The United States has become a nation that consumes everything in sight and yet produces increasingly little.

Do you know what our biggest export is today? Waste paper. Yes, trash is the number one thing that we ship out to the rest of the world as we voraciously blow our money on whatever the rest of the world wants to sell to us. The United States has become bloated and spoiled and our economy is now just a shadow of what it once was. Once upon a time America could literally outproduce the rest of the world combined.

Today, that is no longer true, but Americans sure do consume more than anyone else in the world. If the deindustrialization of America continues at this current pace, what possible kind of a future are we going to be leaving to our children?

Any great nation throughout history has been great at making things. So if the United States continues to allow its manufacturing base to erode at a staggering pace how in the world can the U.S. continue to consider itself to be a great nation? We have created the biggest debt bubble in the history of the world in an effort to maintain a very high standard of living, but the current state of affairs is not anywhere close to sustainable. Every single month America does into more debt and every single month America gets poorer.
So what happens when the debt bubble pops?

The deindustrialization of the United States should be a top concern for every man, woman and child in the country. But sadly, most Americans do not have any idea what is going on around them.

For people like that, take this article and print it out and hand it to them. Perhaps what they will read below will shock them badly enough to awaken them from their slumber.
The following are 19 facts about the deindustrialization of America that will blow your mind...

#1 The United States has lost approximately 42,400 factories since 2001.

#2 Dell Inc., one of America's largest manufacturers of computers, has announced plans to dramatically expand its operations in China with an investment of over $100 billion over the next decade.

#3 Dell has announced that it will be closing its last large U.S. manufacturing facility in Winston-Salem, North Carolina in November. Approximately 900 jobs will be lost.

#4 In 2008, 1.2 billion cellphones were sold worldwide. So how many of them were manufactured inside the United States? Zero.

#5 According to a new study conducted by the Economic Policy Institute, if the U.S. trade deficit with China continues to increase at its current rate, the U.S. economy will lose over half a million jobs this year alone.

#6 As of the end of July, the U.S. trade deficit with China had risen 18 percent compared to the same time period a year ago.

#7 The United States has lost a total of about 5.5 million manufacturing jobs since October 2000.

#8 According to Tax Notes, between 1999 and 2008 employment at the foreign affiliates of U.S. parent companies increased an astounding 30 percent to 10.1 million. During that exact same time period, U.S. employment at American multinational corporations declined 8 percent to 21.1 million.

#9 In 1959, manufacturing represented 28 percent of U.S. economic output. In 2008, it represented 11.5 percent.

#10 Ford Motor Company recently announced the closure of a factory that produces the Ford Ranger in St. Paul, Minnesota. Approximately 750 good paying middle class jobs are going to be lost because making Ford Rangers in Minnesota does not fit in with Ford's new "global" manufacturing strategy.

#11 As of the end of 2009, less than 12 million Americans worked in manufacturing. The last time less than 12 million Americans were employed in manufacturing was in 1941.

#12 In the United States today, consumption accounts for 70 percent of GDP. Of this 70 percent, over half is spent on services.

#13 The United States has lost a whopping 32 percent of its manufacturing jobs since the year 2000.

#14 In 2001, the United States ranked fourth in the world in per capita broadband Internet use. Today it ranks 15th.

#15 Manufacturing employment in the U.S. computer industry is actually lower in 2010 than it was in 1975.

#16 Printed circuit boards are used in tens of thousands of different products. Asia now produces 84 percent of them worldwide.

#17 The United States spends approximately $3.90 on Chinese goods for every $1 that the Chinese spend on goods from the United States.

#18 One prominent economist is projecting that the Chinese economy will be three times larger than the U.S. economy by the year 2040.

#19 The U.S. Census Bureau says that 43.6 million Americans are now living in poverty and according to them that is the highest number of poor Americans in the 51 years that records have been kept.

So, how many tens of thousands more factories do we need to lose before we do something about it?

How many millions more Americans are going to become unemployed before we all admit that we have a very, very serious problem on our hands?

How many more trillions of dollars are going to leave the country before we realize that we are losing wealth at a pace that is killing our economy?

How many once great manufacturing cities are going to become rotting war zones like Detroit before we understand that we are committing national economic suicide? The deindustrialization of America is a national crisis. It needs to be treated like one.

America is in deep, deep trouble folks. It is PAST time to wake up.

******************************************

See this too?

http://www.brillig.com/debt_clock/
 
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