the cook slide

ezra

Well-known member
It Is sad but man people wake up U read these story's and it is mind boggling.
u spend upwards of 20k on sleds and trailers min of 17 hrs each way in a truck.
but u cant find the time all fall to take one of many classes Duffy puts on . or poss watch his video a few times on the way out.
then riding with out tracking equipment are u serious *** .
these guys broke every rule .

the Article
The party of seven Minnesota snowmobilers had been advised that day that the center had rated the avalanche danger as high.

“They talked to the manager of their hotel that morning and he recommended that they not go out,” Knoff said. “They were aware of the hazard.”

Although none of them had avalanche rescue beacons, probes or shovels, the decision was made that riding would be OK if the snowmobilers avoided avalanche terrain, riding in the trees and meadows.

In the morning, the riders stuck to the game plan. But the more they rode, and the more they saw other riders climbing the mountains or saw tracks high up the side of Crown Butte, that initial caution evaporated.

Around 4 p.m., Junkermeier rode his snowmobile about a third of the way up the side of Crown Butte to an elevation of about 9,600 feet. At that point his snowmobile either stalled or he stopped to take in the vast view of the surrounding mountain peaks and snowy valley below. He was last seen pulling his snowmobile’s starter cord.

“His greatest wish in life was to ride his snowmobile out West,” his obituary reads. “It is all he ever talked about.”

As Junkermeier sat on the side of the mountain, two fellow riders rode uphill past him on both sides and the avalanche released. Junkermeier was directly below where the avalanche initially broke loose.

Hair trigger

“It’s just amazing how these things work,” Knoff said. “There are tons and tons of snow all peacefully resting on the side of a mountain, and all it takes is a couple hundred pounds of a snowmachine and a rider to set all of that loose.”

Once the snowpack begins to collapse, the fracture can spread at speeds up to 100 mph.

“It covers a huge slope in no time,” Knoff said. “You don’t have much time to deal with it.”

The snow fractured because buried beneath was a layer of sugary snow with crystals 6 to 10 millimeters in size, called depth hoar. Normal snow crystals are smaller, 1 to 3 mm. The crystals grew large during extremely cold days in early December, before being buried by later snow. Plenty of snow had fallen recently, although the snowpack on that side of Crown Butte remained relatively thin. At the time of the accident, a nearby snow monitoring site recorded 11 feet of snowfall. In the 24 hours before the avalanche, 14 to 20 inches of very
 
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Deleted member 10829

Guest
Geez, these guys need to be prepared. Plus, I don't ride in the mountains and even I know you don't ride above someone at any time! I think another sledder was lost that way this year when a buddy stopped above him to help him get unstuck. Sad is right!
 

Firecatguy

New member
excuses no longer work!!!idiots they knew better....you cant goto cooke city without someone asking if you know what your doing..from lodging to just talking to people in town you know that a beacon is needed....if one guy i group did not know OK but entire group??no way....
 

srt20

Active member
Not to mention the beacon check on the way out of town....every local we talked to (all 3 that live in town) told us of the high avy threat.

We were there a few days before this slide. It was snowing wet heavy southern WI snow pretty much for 2 days right before the slide. Nobody was riding this hill. Or really any of the other steep stuff right there.
 

ezra

Well-known member
well by the look of the slide out the kid had that 20min to just sit trapped there and wish he had on a beacon
 

ezra

Well-known member
like I said I just cant imagine why u would head to the hills with out at minn a beacon and probe.
come on is it that hard to go to a avvy class heck brp has a bunch for free .
yeah real torture to have to go out of the house in the fall after work and hang out with a dealership full of like minded guys.
tracks USA should have Duffy do his class in there warehouse prob a full house
 

polarisrider1

New member
I just don't get it. Bear claw Bob rents beacons cheep. Cooke city has a avy tester on the trail as you leave town. You don't even have to get off your sled to see that it is working. Beacon is to be found and to find others.
Beacon, shovel,probe and an avy class is minimum. Anything less and you are on borrowed time.
 

doospunk

Active member
Not sure what their train of thought was..., but makes no sense. Feel like saying more, but every post above pretty much sums it up.
 

carter

New member
Not yet............I'm not going to let this go away. It's time to have a diaolouge about this and not in calm manner. It's time to rattle the cage and make some people mad. This is not about Mike Duffies class. This is about the lame excuses we try to place on the events after they happen. I'm not a Techi, but I know there are several places to get class type info on avalanche training. All of it good in its own way to helping us start a REVOLUTION on the stupidity out there. If I am offending anyone in particular I intend to continue to do that til you get it through your thick heads that this is no longer a joke. The flatland snowmobile community has to wake up. The mountain snowmobile community is light years ahead when it comes to training, and we are behind. What makes you think its ok to show up out here and put stress and anguish on the people who are morally obligated to come and rescue you. I get to live with the vision of your dead corpse for a long time. Then to find out you were stupid to boot, only makes it worse. I now get to be pissed and have the stress. Notice how I haven't mentioned family.........Look around your circle, the things you are required to have training for in your lives.......owning a sled and having the desire to ride in the mountains is no longer enough. Take that testostrone and put it into some useful like training that will help this recreation. Put it into knowledge that will tell your wife and kids you care and will be coming home to them. Training that tells the stupid brain dead jerks in your circle and all the other ones that don't think, its time to take a stand and learn this stuff, apply it to safe riding and care about this, or sell that thing and don't come out here.......I don't think you can understand how angry I am that rule #1 in training got broke twice and we had 2 deaths........Mike Duffy used to have class in Denver. Then he started coming to you. Yes it's a business, but he cares about the sport and is out there, along with all the other good trainers, trying to tell you to get your heads out of your testostorone and learn this stuff. I will no longer subscribe to the theory that the customer is always right...........coming out here without the necessary training to ride safely in the mountains is no longer acceptable.......
 

mnuser

Member
Perfect response Carter. I understand what you mean and always tell my buddy who goes out West without the avalanche gear how stupid he is to not have it. 12,000 sled and no gear!
 

carter

New member
This is not the response I'm looking for.................mnuser....you have to tell your retard friend he has no one to go with out west. We will no longer tolerate this kind of thinking or behavior......he's got 8 months to train and learn this stuff. Or become a relic to the snowmobile world cuz you ain't going with him.....He's welcome to ride his mountain sled in Hurley............

- - - Updated - - -

As I said, I'm not going to let up on this all summer. You people either find a way to take and understand the training, or get a moderator to kick me off the web site..........and judging by his response that's not going to happen.
 

ezra

Well-known member
IMHO places like your place of employment have the power to make a change.
don't have a receipt from the last 3 yrs of taking a class u can not use our guides or rent our sleds.
they can offer 1 night video crash course good for 1 yr.
some mat think it is kind of harsh but I don't think so.
U know what guys like Dan A would do with a crew who showed up with nothing but there ***** in there hand thinking they were going to pretend they were on a 509 shoot.
not a hard policy for a lodge to implement.
Imho should be a fine like seatbelts but higher if forest service catches u with out
 

polarisrider1

New member
This year at Tog. I had my eye on a mtn. all week. Midway thru my last day my guide Nathan Stopped out a couple hundred yards from the base. He said take a look at that mtn. Looks sweet, no obvious reason not to rip it up. I stared at it, picking out lines in my head. He said, "well guys that is where we pulled out a young man from an avy, his sled is still buried in there. You can not even tell it slide. It would ruin my life to lose one of you there." Reality set in. No guarantees. I am shopping an air bag avy pack and I listen to the guides.
 

ezra

Well-known member
the bags are getting cheep .have been on first place a few times this week. I want a airline flyable set up putting serious thought in to storing sleds and flying out next yr.
 

carter

New member
Ezra, you are all wrong. This has nothing to do with a place that provides you with a place to eat drink and sleep for a fee.That lodge would love to put down rules for training. The whole point is its not up to them.And thats the reason for this discussion. Its up to you and me and the next guy and every person who rides out here and is tired of statements like you made about what they should do. You get trained, you advocate training for others you you lead others down the path instead of trying to pass the buck on to a lodge. Its your responsibility unto your self. In this messed up world, that class or course you speak of would become a lawsuit at the first death. Didn't train my husband good enough. Its not their job to train people .......but by god its their job to rescue people who have no training. That moral obligation thing again. Why can't the human do for himself before he gets here, like he does with everything else. You don't ask the lodge for help in the purchase of a sled or for that matter where to go to ride it. Step up and see the importance of the training on your own.
 
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