Time for a 4 stroke!

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whitedust

Well-known member
famousguy you would have to look up each OEM 120 to 140hp 2s engine sleds & then compare 120hp to 140 hp 4s sleds. Not many new 120hp 4s since they produce 125-139 hp when dynoed. 2s 120hp could be 118hp just real world of hp 2s & 4s & power bands very different as well.

The weight issue is becoming a non issue because new 4s sleds are so well balanced. Back in 90s trail sled weight was a HUGE issue.... throwing my 98 Mach around took a lot of effort.

Throwing around my 600 lb 150hp 4s Attack on trail is not an issue off trail.. Yes.

The 2s vs 4s weight is not a trail handling issue & that is why 4s trail sleds are becoming soooo popular...good gas milage, broad power band,no oil smell, gas & go sleds like cars.

You need to test ride a 4s so you can see why they are becoming so popular.

If you want the lightest 4s sleds check out doo lots of 4s models.

AC,Poo & Yam heavier 4s sleds but handle very well.

I hope this helps but ride a 4s first then ask yourself if weight matters on trail. It is a non issue to me 07 Attack GT best sled I have owned & I used to be a 2s doo rider
 
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whitedust

Well-known member
iusmit: My buddies 2006 4s Rage sits for 3-4 weeks between rides & starts right up. Yam sells small jumper cable package if you are worried about dead battery that fits in seat compartment. You will get over the dead battery fear as the years pass by & no problems.
 
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thebreeze

Member
The only point I was trying to make is that to say "There is no reason to go 2 stroke anymore unless you like paying a extra buck a gallon for fuel" is pure crazy talk.
 
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rsvectordude

New member
I haven't touched my battery in going on 5 years. I never charge it in the off season or riding season. As far as trail riding they simply cannot be beat. Every year we have a 2 stroke in our group blow up and it's usually a SKI DOO. Ideally a person needs both. A long tracked 2 stroke for off trail and a 4 stroke for long trail riding. Neither excel in both categories.
 
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anonomoose

New member
Typically there is about 80-100 lbs difference in weight between the two.

When you put a 200+ rider w/gear on a 450 lb two stroke, you have 650 lbs....or 750 with a 4 stroke. This amounts to about 12% difference. Not enough to be concerned with for most folks. Pay attention to track/ski setup and gearing and 4's make for decent off trail sleds. Try and just take a 4 off trail with no adjustments and they don't work well, but then lots of 2 strokes have the same issues.

Technique is far more important. Momentum, ski stance, traction, will rule the day as well as snow conditions.

I have used a pair of 4's off trail for 3 years and I wouldn't go back. I don't stick them much either.

On trail all the above issues are not important.

You will see more and more 4's over time and like two cylinder John Deere's...they will be around, but not the main stable for most folks who need to be back home on Monday.

Oh, and they can be started with a strap on the primary, quite easily...not that you will ever pull that strap out of the tool box and use it...but it might be peace of mind.

Unfortunately, the newer sleds need good battery power to even run...so unless it is just a stuck starter, you will walk if the battery craps out.
 
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beakjones

Member
WTH? All our 2 strokes start properly. Couple of pulls. Know the temperature, how much choke your going to have to use, let it warm 5-10 minutes, stop to put gas in it, and go. Never had one burn down; what can I say? I don't doubt a 2smoke will blow up more easily, you guys make it sound like the blow up every other ride though lol.

I agree that a 4stroke would be better for trail riding though.
 
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thebreeze

Member
4 strokes are great for trail cruising and I agree with rsvector dude that in an ideal world we would all have 1 of each. A nice lightweight longtrack 2 stroke and a 4 stroke trail cruiser (ideally with a turbo on each) lol.
 
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whitedust

Well-known member
beakjones: I just can not get 5000 miles out of an injected 2s without bag,pop & end of engine! Older 2s yes but newer injected 2s & power cruising in the MIUP is formula for a burndown for me. 2s factory crank seals just don't do the job & no lube to the crank not a good thing at high speeds. ETEC the faster you go the more oil you will use & maybe still not enough to keep everything lubricated. Power cruising 300+ mile trail days is 4s all the way.
 
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G

Guest
4's are heavier period. A lot of that weight is in the much-taller-than-a-two-stroke engine. The weight is carried higher which is inherently bad for just about all handling conditions if you are really pushing it. Four stroke sleds are not competitive in cross country races. Yamaha put Cory Davidson on the best they could build and he never came close. They have since pretty much given up on CC races. "Doo pretty much owns cross country at this point in time. That is the best example of the difference weight makes. However, most of us on this site don't run cross country races. For trail riding it is hard to beat the new fours. If you are into heavy boondocking and ride with the intention of getting stuck from time to time you will get really strong if you choose a four. Stuck is when you realize weight differences. I am old now just like to trail ride. The Yamis are rock solid dependable. I am not afraid to take off alone on a 150 mile trip. I have had four of them and have never been towed once. It is all about how you prefer to ride and what you like to do. To each his own. I'm glad we still have the choice.
 
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propjockey

New member
Yikes, this thread is starting to get warm...I think my profile answers "my side" of this debate.
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rocketman356

New member
We have paid up 2 $18 a quart in out areas for the fancy 2stroke oil.Yaa go about 130 miles on a tank of gas and burn a quart of oil.Who is nuttz now.
 
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coldbear

New member
I run Ski-Doo oil in my weed eater just to remember the great winter times.I love the 2 strokes, older people love the 4 strokes.
 
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ezra

Well-known member
I picked up the yellowstone spec cat the first year it came out. the goofy drk green one.big mistake top heavy tank .the wife put 60 mi on it I could not give it away.but it did get good mpg.I have ridden the new yammi 3cyl on the river it is great. on the rail grade it is great.for the tight local woods trails it is ok. for ditch banging it sucks. in the woods off trail I wanted my sled back after 15 min. and the owner of that yammi still has the yammi but also has a crossfire 8. I wish I could justify the 11g for the z1turbo I would get one just for the river and lakes and for long drags.for the 660 ft mark I still have not had one take the 1010 cat eaven turbos or nos .in longer races thay start to shine but need 1000 ft or better to spool up.then thay are rocking
 
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rocketman356

New member
erza the new 4 stroke Doo's weigh the same as a 2 stroke 800 Polaris or Cat.Put on a aftermarket turbo and they rock.No and I mean no turbo lag.
 
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famousguy

New member
Well, I am sure the 4 strokes are great and keep getting better, but it seems as though some on here act as though we should scrap all of the 2 strokes. Hey, maybe Obama Bin Ladin will do a cash for 2 strokes program!!

I think the weight is the biggest problem even on the trails, if you push 80 extra pounds around all day for 300+ miles, you will feel it.

As for the cost of oil, that is minimal. You can buy oil cheap if you don't buy Doo,Poo,Yam, or Cat oil. If you are paying $18 a quart for oil, you are just not doing your homework and throwing your money away.
 
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