Unemployment map 2007-2010
- Thread starter ubee
- Start date
And the giant is getting educated. Bad news for Progressives
I didn't want to believe him, but he keeps being right.
I have started studying our founders, and the start of this country, and boy have we strayed. I pray for all of us that we forget the R and the D, and become Americans again.
anonomoose
New member
This crap just kills me....what do they get up in the morning and read tea leaves, or stroke each other and see how they feel afterwords???
It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that if people aren't making money they aren't going to spend it. Does that mean that since 15% of the country is out of work we will NEVER EVER come back from this???
And what about having a job before you go buy a car, truck, TV, RV, house....not going to happen is it??
Frankly I don't think that we are being handed the real truth. Maybe as jack nickle-son says, "we can't handle the truth...." for fear of everyone panicking and sitting home holding the cat and crying in our beer (notice I never give up my beer ...no matter what!!).
Fact is I agree with MJK here in that BOTH POLITICAL parties have left me behind. Neither one represent me anymore. Maybe they changed, or maybe I got smarter (doubt that one....) but I am lost without a party right now and feel nobody represents me. For the record, I did NOT vote for Ross P. but my dad did because he felt what he said was spot on target....but then he put that lame brain up for VP, and I felt that meant that he wasn't really serious or perhaps I would have voted for him. Meanwhile slick willie got in there milked out the good times...basically did nothing to make this better or worse (don't forget the euphoric dot com point in history where everyone was making money hand over fist and all you had to do was to invest in SOMETHING, and you made money) so Billy boy took the credit but as the saying goes, it is always better to be lucky than be smart...always. He was in the right place at the right time. Unfortunately Georgie Porgy, was NOT.
Meanwhile the country is busy sucking an egg....(do they really believe that this could be a jobless recovery??? Isn't that more or less like getting pregnant by sitting wrong on a toilet seat????)
We aren't turning any corners, without industry, and housing. Both are vitally important...and we simply are not going to get out of this hole in the ground until we find a fix for these. Screw wall street...who needs em??? We need to find a way to play a great big "do over" on all this, but I just don't think anyone knows how to do that...certainly not me.
But I do know that the fundamentals need to be protected, and invested in. Buy American or don't buy anything. Better yet, but locally since locally has the highest return on your "investment" which keeps YOU working.
I will do some research and find some websites that list American made products. There are more of them than you think...including toys which don't stunt children's growth.... oh, and era...your one crazy guy...but you sure have a good eye for the truth.
Over the years, has education stessed "good business practices" to the point of sacrificing common sense, a hard work ethic, a willingness to get dirty and an attitude of "no job is too small"? While there are huge numbers of Americans that can are great examples of the good traits, it just seems our leaders, both political and business are only concerned with personal gains regardless of sacrifice and rationalizing it as "good business".
Good luck to the ones who keep working hard regardless of the task. To the rest, what goes around, comes around. It can't happen soon enough!
Good luck to the ones who keep working hard regardless of the task. To the rest, what goes around, comes around. It can't happen soon enough!
anonomoose
New member
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Together we can make a difference. United we can tell corporate america we won't take it any more. They will listen if we do our job.
Make a difference, watch it work!
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snootbiscuit
New member
can anyone say "impeachment" !!!!
I find it interesting that nobody has mentioned "The Unions" when discussing manufacturing jobs leaving the U.S.?? They became too greedy and never thought they'd "organize" themselves out of a job. Where I live, in Iowa, we have first hand knowledge of large fortune 500 companies leaving for other states/countries that agreed to not form unions. When a large company is creating its budget it's pretty simple to see the difference between the pay and benefits for union vs. non-union. Simple economics. With that said, we can't undo the past, but we need to realize that we can NOT tax and spend out way out of these difficult times. Oblabla and other socialist want to beat you down so far that you NEED the gov't to exist. I've been hunting, fishing, gathering ammo and stockpiling a cellar for a couple years now, so if our family hits tough times, we could exist for a few years. You may view this as extreme but I refuse to fall prey to our government!
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anonomoose
New member
Okay...repeat after me....breath deeply and say, "I'm okay, and your okay, so we can all get along together."
Now don't you feel better?
I have never (well almost never) belonged to a union but if there are 5 companies doing business, and 2 are union and 3 are non-union, the three non-union will scale their work and prices very close to that of the union businesses, because they know that they need to keep pace with union pricing or lose talent if they don't. Same work almost the same pay, brought about by pricing of the union scale busineses.
Once those union scales are gone....there is nothing to hold the prices up except other businesses in a totally competitive pricing world and the price of labor will fall like a stone.
Not saying this is right or wrong, but until now union scale upheld the pricing of jobs...labor and that kept everyone in a good wage bracket.
I'm not supporting union here; just stating facts. Unions might have gone overboard, but they brought a good wage scale along with everything they did, good bad or indifferent.
When a business can pack it up and move to a 3rd world country where they have zero pollution controls, no pension payments, no medical costs, and people are willing to work for $5 per week, NO amount of negotiating would keep them in America IF...and that is a big if....the widget they are making is identical to the one made in the USA. Corporate America doesn't care where the thing is made, only how big is the profit once it is made.
"Once those union scales are gone....there is nothing to hold the prices up except other businesses in a totally competitive pricing world and the price of labor will fall like a stone.
Not saying this is right or wrong, but until now union scale upheld the pricing of jobs...labor and that kept everyone in a good wage bracket."
This is the problem. Unions artificially "held up" wages. If the job you're doing is really a skill position, companies will pay top dollar for top talent. Suuply and demand. If all you're doing is screwing something together all day, and anyone can be plugged into that job, the pay should be low. Those of us with talent and skills will do just fine. I have never been in a union, and am in manufacturing. After 20 years, owning my own shop, and getting really good, I am now in demand, and being paid accordingly. No help from the union, just my own merits.
snowdancer
New member
In the U.S., Bush, who had worked to "fast track" the signing prior to the end of his term, ran out of time and had to pass the required ratification and signing into law to incoming president Bill Clinton. Prior to sending it to the House of Representatives, Clinton introduced clauses to protect American workers and allay the concerns of many House members. It also required U.S. partners to adhere to environmental practices and regulations similar to its own. The ability to enforce these clauses, especially with Mexico, and with much consideration and emotional discussion the House of Representatives approved NAFTA on November 17, 1993, by a vote of 234 to 200. The agreement's supporters included 132 Republicans and 102 Democrats. NAFTA passed the Senate 61-38. Clinton signed it into law on December 8, 1993; it went into effect on January 1, 1994---- Just thought I would clarify a couple things here-- Bush Sr. started this, and if you remember Clinton was working with a REPUBLICAN senate and congress who obviously were not all that worried about the loss of jobs. And all through Bush jrs. term you'll notice there was no mention of repealing NAFTA. Jrs. position was "oh well, if you can't find a job, just go join the military."
I knew union's would be brought into things sooner or later they allways do.
Both union and non union has there benifit so work the one for you. But please dont call
me lazy and over paid when you dont know me and i dont know you.
We the people judge things to much. Who are you or i to say someone is lazy or
over paid? Why cant we worry about ourselves? Cause you know the guy who you think is lazy and over paid might think the same about you.
How many people here think 10$ a hour flippin burgers is over paid? If you said yes then i ask you would you do that job for 10$ a hour? If you said no then who are you to say thats over paid?
Bash unions all you want but in the end it's the employer/manufator/company who set's the price for services and product's we the consumers pay for. And they set there price to what they want to make or think they can get the job for period. Company's spend millions of dollars doing research on stuff like this. So while we complain about the guy makein 20$ a hour we forget that the company/manufactor/employer is make much much more in many cases. But we the consumer forget that portion of it. And thats the way they want it.
United we stand
divited we fall
Take your pick where this country is and will allways be
Both union and non union has there benifit so work the one for you. But please dont call
me lazy and over paid when you dont know me and i dont know you.
We the people judge things to much. Who are you or i to say someone is lazy or
over paid? Why cant we worry about ourselves? Cause you know the guy who you think is lazy and over paid might think the same about you.
How many people here think 10$ a hour flippin burgers is over paid? If you said yes then i ask you would you do that job for 10$ a hour? If you said no then who are you to say thats over paid?
Bash unions all you want but in the end it's the employer/manufator/company who set's the price for services and product's we the consumers pay for. And they set there price to what they want to make or think they can get the job for period. Company's spend millions of dollars doing research on stuff like this. So while we complain about the guy makein 20$ a hour we forget that the company/manufactor/employer is make much much more in many cases. But we the consumer forget that portion of it. And thats the way they want it.
United we stand
divited we fall
Take your pick where this country is and will allways be
Case in point:
http://www.parentdish.com/2010/02/2...ucation-lauds-decision-to-fire-entire-school/
These people think they deserve their jobs even when the performance isn't there, because they are in the union. If they were paid according to their individual performance, they wouldn't have all been fired. This superintendent is a hero, and savior to these kids and their future. Too bad the teachers union didn't care about them, just their members.
http://www.parentdish.com/2010/02/2...ucation-lauds-decision-to-fire-entire-school/
These people think they deserve their jobs even when the performance isn't there, because they are in the union. If they were paid according to their individual performance, they wouldn't have all been fired. This superintendent is a hero, and savior to these kids and their future. Too bad the teachers union didn't care about them, just their members.
I really have to ask did you read the article??? Because to me that link shows why we need better union's and more workers right.
Who here is gonna work a extra 25 min a day for free? Come in earlly and stay late for free? And because these teachers refuse to do stuff for free there gonna be fired??
You wanna use this as a "case in point" You cant teach stupid can you? When does the child and parents take some responsibilities for there action's or childrens action? How many of these kids who aint learning are going home and studying every nite?
The point i made earlier we judge others and dont take responsibility for ourselves
Lets get a bunch of unskilled low pay teachers in there and see if things improve. Then we'll see who the real hero is
miaferominka
New member
Because a person is not in a Union doesnt not make them unskilled.
I never said non union workers were unskilled.
What "first hand knowledge" ? - those word are usually baseless. I am not in a union but don't be so quick to blame them for the oversees movement of company production. Those decisions are most often nothing but bottom line decisions. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to realize that you can make a greater profit hiring someone in india, indonesia or china for much less than an American. I don't know what kind of job you have , but even engineers are being outsourced because its cheaper to have an engineering location in india, indonesia or china rather than paying $80-100 thousand for an American engineer. Where does the bottom lining by the corporation heads end. These CEO's and CFO's that you are defending are just employees themselves - when will they be outsourced. I don't know what your position is, but these Americans out of work are the people we depend on to buy our products, services, our homes and to pay taxes. With them out of work everyone of us suffers. It's time to quit blaming - and expecially the current president who inherited this mess. Yes the unions were greedy, but the corporate heads (who are also emloyees) give themselves multimillion dollar salaries cannot be excused in any rational way. It's time to start thinking about others. Burying our heads in Rush's backyard won't solve the problem.