Why Snowmobiling Will End

[sweeperguy]

HAVE NOT SEEN THIS FOR SOME TIME FIGURED I'D BRING IT BACK AGAIN We need to remember this CAN happen

The Day The Snowmobiles Stopped (Randy Toth)*
Published on November 16, 2012 in*Guest Columns,News & Updates*

One chilly fall day in the not too distant future, as you prepare for the upcoming snowmobiling season, you will remember that you have not received your state association magazine yet. Muttering something derogatory, you go to the state association’s website only to find a notation from the ISP (Internet Service Provider) that the domain name is now available for sale to any interested parties. Huh?

YOUR SNOWMOBILE CLUB HAS DISBANDED!

You call up a friend and ask “What’s up with the state association?” He informs you that last spring they announced that they were disbanding due to lack of volunteer support. “Well exactly what did they ever do for me?” you say. Then you call one of your local club officers only to find that no one volunteered to run for club office and that the current president and vice president had retired and moved south.

Your club has also disbanded and sold your grooming equipment to an out of state club and donated the remaining club money to charity. Your buddy says that the club two towns over is still active and he has joined there, so you decide that you will join there also. He then mentions that the dues have gone way up since the state association is no longer around to provide some much needed grooming money.

You decide you had better go to a club meeting to find out what’s really happening. The club meeting holds a few surprises for you as they discuss their huge loss of former friendly landowners. Apparently when they found out that they were no longer covered by the state association sponsored liability insurance, they immediately revoked permission to ride on their land. You also find out that you can no longer ride from one state property to another because of the lack of private landowner connector trails. “OK,” you say, “I will just ride in my local state forest then.” Of course without your old local club there is no grooming or snowmobile trail maintenance in your local state forest. There is still riding there but only on about 15 miles of unmaintained and ungroomed trails. Furthermore, you no longer have riding access to any food or gas because those connector trails were located on private land.

The next day you read in the paper that snowmobiles are being banned on a number of state lands due to damage caused by wheeled vehicles. Incredibly, no one attended any of the planning meetings and spoke up and defended snowmobiling – which have virtually no negative impact on trails. With no organized opposition, snowmobiles were simply banned along with wheeled vehicles.

RADICAL ACTIVISTS

There is also a notice that an environmental group is fighting hard to pass a state law banning all internal combustion engines on state land to protect the health of native miniature snails. Who do you turn to? “I’ll just call my local representative or senator,” you decide. The call goes something like “Hi, I’m Joe and I like to snowmobile so you need to help me.” The response is something like, “Thank you for calling to express your opinion, we will tell your representative or senator that you called – what organization did you say you were representing?” Now you start to sweat and remember having heard about how to approach your representative or senator from your state association, and you realize that your encounter didn’t just go as you had planned.

Ok, so you and your friends decide your club should hire a lobbyist. Now, just how will you find one and pay for her? Your club will just have to raise lots of money – somehow. Of course you always voted against dues increases on principle in the past. You then remember that in the past, revenue from the state association’s trail passes and Sno-Expo helped fund these key access-related activities. Furthermore, many of your friends said they weren’t going to even join the club until there was rideable snow on the ground, because they remember a year in the past when there wasn’t much snow.

HELP!

You call some likeminded friends and you all agree to organize to fight these injustices, but you have no clue how to begin. You also start to experience that sinking feeling that it might already be too late. You want to turn to the guys who have always maintained and groomed the trails for help.

Did you know the average age of an active three-man trail crew in the western part of the state, who maintains snowmobile trails on a very large tract of state land now, is over 70 years old? No answer when you call. You call your friend back only to learn that two of the three have retired from trail work and the other is no longer around. Now what? Where are all of the younger folks who were supposed to take over? You then cringe at the thought that you personally have said many times, “I’ll help when I get around to it,” but you never did.

Well, you can always drive to nearby states where they used to have large trail systems. Maybe they’re still in operation?

To get your mind off of this mess, you then decide to drive out of state to attend a snow show. Your wife reminds you that with gas prices at $6 a gallon you can’t afford to, since you will need to save the money to go snowmobiling. OK, you decide to go to the smaller snow show in your own state. Darn! – the lack of volunteers and support caused it to fold a couple of years ago. Remember how you and your friends said that there were bigger and better shows elsewhere, so why should you support your local one?

If you think that this scenario can’t happen, just sit back, put your feet up, do nothing and wait. It may now be later than you think!

Perhaps someone will be kind enough to send me an email in Florida and tell me how it all turns out. Meanwhile, I’ll be out riding around Tampa Bay on my personal watercraft and volunteering with the senior section of the local Personal Watercraft Club. Happy Riding!

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[mrbb]

I think at the rate we get snow anymore, its going to be loss of snow in winter time that kills this sport LOL

 

[GTL]

Well stated-------------I made an estimate of the average age of our group at the last meeting and hit 65 !!!! I will as long as I can, but somebody better step up-----------or give up, 'cause it ain't changing anywhere.... My own ride but don't belong OR help out????

 

[gary_in_neenah]

There's a saying in our group that "10% of the members do 90% of the work." Usually the same ones at the meetings though our fundraisers are well represented. It's always been hard to get volunteers on the weekends and people seem busier now than ever. We saw an influx of new blood when the AWSC became the source for Trail Permits but most were just there for the discount.

Personally, I think the cost of getting into snowmobiling today is the biggest threat to the sport. Machine, gear, tow vehicle and trailer, gas for the road-gas for the trail, lodging, food and beverage, etc. Add in the low-snow years and the volunteers are getting older, we could see some drastic changes in the next generation or two.

 

[Deleted member 10829]

I would say 5% do 100% of the work. I've been to our County meetings and I'm by far the youngest one there at 56. I would put the average age at close to 70. Who will do all of the work in 10-15 years?

 

[snowchief]

I am still the kid in our club at 36 next youngest is upper 50s 60

 

[renegade]

We have seen a uptick in help since the trail pass. Hopfully that remains true. Far as cost goes, it is expensive. Lots of real good deals on craigslist last night though.

 

[xcr440]

Families with kids and their activities just don’t have the time nor the funds for another expensive sport. My son turned 21 this past week, and he had his biggest year of riding based on miles. He has helped out on the trails here locally the last few years, but doesn’t have time for the club meetings.

The up north clubs are going to need help from us down south club members to keep their trails going for those of us who ride them. A few of us will be making a fall run or two to help out where we can next season. Specifically the Ely club needs help, as their numbers have dwindled significantly. We talked with them in January and they really need the help. I’m sure they aren’t alone.

 

[renegade]

Its all about priorities. No one seems to have time for snowmobiling until trails are open. Thats the biggest problem this sport will always have. I always hear the excuse of bow huntng. Can't mark this weekend, its bow season! Really, you can't take one day off from a season that lasts months? But thta guy will have the most miles come march.

 

[Tracker]

The up north clubs are going to need help from us down south club members to keep their trails going for those of us who ride them.

heres what I see from down south....we also want a snowmobile club....and they have thousands more miles of trails than all of Wisconsin put together....but they call them bike trails.....so I went to the Indiana snowmobile assoc. to see if I could join and get a plan together to have a trail system like yours in WI and MI and MN and others....what ultimately happened was every city we went to to see if we could use the trails from dec to march just like up north....where told NO WAY....NOT EVER....NO MOTORIZED VEHICLES....PERIOD.....city after city...all te while those same cities were connecting the bike paths so you could ride from Wisconsin around lake Michigan across Indiana to Michigan...its almost finished...I buy a trail pass for Indiana...state sticker...what does it go for? the bike trails....haha....so too put it short...no access....no club needed....the sled system is very very small....and on your end....the locals that live in your town and ride in the northern states....most of them say....I don't need a trail pass I live here...not gonna buy one....not gonna help either...joey does it all in our town....so the club participation is also low in the north....by the very people who use them everyday....there is way more to all this but this is basics....so one fix that I see needs to happen in RE to the above story that might fix it for the future....each state system should no longer be its own entity.....we should all pay X amount each year (ex. $200 US)....for a NATION WIDE trail system that encompasses ATV's, pedal bikes, cross country skiers, sledders...you name it....and they would all be allowed at one time or another to use the trails....and have to share....now instead of being against each other and each sport....we would all be one....and some that don't like the other group would be forced to work together on the same trail....have membership just like clubs today....participation and money would increase for all....the southern cities would have to capitulate on the no vehicle clause....which would then create positive attitudes for the ones being snubbed as per the article.....help would follow because the workers on a nation wide trail system would be sent to the area that needs attention first and it would have help from people that never would of in the 1 st place since no MN dude is ever gonna help a WI dude as it is right now....it could be like Canada....you don't join....you don't ride.....just a thought

PS....don't most of the clubs up north consist of retired southerners that buy a place up north? whats the percentage? snowmobiling wont end...but it does need to morph as the times they have changed

 

[LoveMyDobe]

The club in Iron River WI disbanded about 5 years ago, most members where elderly but had been with the club for years. We had one board member that caused quite a lot of drama with members so many quit. When it came to doing fundraisers we had less than a handful left to help so that didn't happen. We sent out letters for help, nothing. We decided to disband, sent letters out, no one responded, including the businesses,. So we donated the money we had left to several local charities. Now the businesses are wondering why no club. The Bayfield Co snowmobile alliance still grooms our trails. Our local ATV club rocks, we do the grading with 2 tractors and drags for the summer trails which some dual use in winter. Our members are getting older, but still help. The businesses support us.

 

[scoot]

Rant on.
I've been an active snowmobile club member working the trails since I was a kid in the early '70s. About 50% down here, 50% up north. From driving posts, brushing, sweet talking property owners, working fund raisers, attending and voting at association meetings, to operating and welding on groomers. I've been telling them for years to find a replacement for me to no avail. Its hard to believe in today's world no one wants to step up, eh? My adult kids have decided that they have no intention of ever continuing the sport with our grandkids unless things change. I respect that. I've said it hundreds of times, attract the families back to the sport or watch it die a slow death. This was the first winter I haven't worked a day on the trails 47 years, so I guess I'm officially retired. But call me when the trails become family friendly enough so that my granddaughters on their ZR200s aren't afraid for their lives to ride them in public.
Rant off.

 

[byr 13]

HAVE NOT SEEN THIS FOR SOME TIME FIGURED I'D BRING IT BACK AGAIN We need to remember this CAN happen

The Day The Snowmobiles Stopped (Randy Toth)*
Published on November 16, 2012 in*Guest Columns,News & Updates*

One chilly fall day in the not too distant future, as you prepare for the upcoming snowmobiling season, you will remember that you have not received your state association magazine yet. Muttering something derogatory, you go to the state association’s website only to find a notation from the ISP (Internet Service Provider) that the domain name is now available for sale to any interested parties. Huh?

YOUR SNOWMOBILE CLUB HAS DISBANDED!

You call up a friend and ask “What’s up with the state association?” He informs you that last spring they announced that they were disbanding due to lack of volunteer support. “Well exactly what did they ever do for me?” you say. Then you call one of your local club officers only to find that no one volunteered to run for club office and that the current president and vice president had retired and moved south.

Your club has also disbanded and sold your grooming equipment to an out of state club and donated the remaining club money to charity. Your buddy says that the club two towns over is still active and he has joined there, so you decide that you will join there also. He then mentions that the dues have gone way up since the state association is no longer around to provide some much needed grooming money.

You decide you had better go to a club meeting to find out what’s really happening. The club meeting holds a few surprises for you as they discuss their huge loss of former friendly landowners. Apparently when they found out that they were no longer covered by the state association sponsored liability insurance, they immediately revoked permission to ride on their land. You also find out that you can no longer ride from one state property to another because of the lack of private landowner connector trails. “OK,” you say, “I will just ride in my local state forest then.” Of course without your old local club there is no grooming or snowmobile trail maintenance in your local state forest. There is still riding there but only on about 15 miles of unmaintained and ungroomed trails. Furthermore, you no longer have riding access to any food or gas because those connector trails were located on private land.

The next day you read in the paper that snowmobiles are being banned on a number of state lands due to damage caused by wheeled vehicles. Incredibly, no one attended any of the planning meetings and spoke up and defended snowmobiling – which have virtually no negative impact on trails. With no organized opposition, snowmobiles were simply banned along with wheeled vehicles.

RADICAL ACTIVISTS

There is also a notice that an environmental group is fighting hard to pass a state law banning all internal combustion engines on state land to protect the health of native miniature snails. Who do you turn to? “I’ll just call my local representative or senator,” you decide. The call goes something like “Hi, I’m Joe and I like to snowmobile so you need to help me.” The response is something like, “Thank you for calling to express your opinion, we will tell your representative or senator that you called – what organization did you say you were representing?” Now you start to sweat and remember having heard about how to approach your representative or senator from your state association, and you realize that your encounter didn’t just go as you had planned.

Ok, so you and your friends decide your club should hire a lobbyist. Now, just how will you find one and pay for her? Your club will just have to raise lots of money – somehow. Of course you always voted against dues increases on principle in the past. You then remember that in the past, revenue from the state association’s trail passes and Sno-Expo helped fund these key access-related activities. Furthermore, many of your friends said they weren’t going to even join the club until there was rideable snow on the ground, because they remember a year in the past when there wasn’t much snow.

HELP!

You call some likeminded friends and you all agree to organize to fight these injustices, but you have no clue how to begin. You also start to experience that sinking feeling that it might already be too late. You want to turn to the guys who have always maintained and groomed the trails for help.

Did you know the average age of an active three-man trail crew in the western part of the state, who maintains snowmobile trails on a very large tract of state land now, is over 70 years old? No answer when you call. You call your friend back only to learn that two of the three have retired from trail work and the other is no longer around. Now what? Where are all of the younger folks who were supposed to take over? You then cringe at the thought that you personally have said many times, “I’ll help when I get around to it,” but you never did.

Well, you can always drive to nearby states where they used to have large trail systems. Maybe they’re still in operation?

To get your mind off of this mess, you then decide to drive out of state to attend a snow show. Your wife reminds you that with gas prices at $6 a gallon you can’t afford to, since you will need to save the money to go snowmobiling. OK, you decide to go to the smaller snow show in your own state. Darn! – the lack of volunteers and support caused it to fold a couple of years ago. Remember how you and your friends said that there were bigger and better shows elsewhere, so why should you support your local one?

If you think that this scenario can’t happen, just sit back, put your feet up, do nothing and wait. It may now be later than you think!

Perhaps someone will be kind enough to send me an email in Florida and tell me how it all turns out. Meanwhile, I’ll be out riding around Tampa Bay on my personal watercraft and volunteering with the senior section of the local Personal Watercraft Club. Happy Riding!

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sad, but true

 

[mrbb]

Rant on.
I've been an active snowmobile club member working the trails since I was a kid in the early '70s. About 50% down here, 50% up north. From driving posts, brushing, sweet talking property owners, working fund raisers, attending and voting at association meetings, to operating and welding on groomers. I've been telling them for years to find a replacement for me to no avail. Its hard to believe in today's world no one wants to step up, eh? My adult kids have decided that they have no intention of ever continuing the sport with our grandkids unless things change. I respect that. I've said it hundreds of times, attract the families back to the sport or watch it die a slow death. This was the first winter I haven't worked a day on the trails 47 years, so I guess I'm officially retired. But call me when the trails become family friendly enough so that my granddaughters on their ZR200s aren't afraid for their lives to ride them in public.
Rant off.

I been involved in this sport since the 70's
in the late 80's early 90's our first club near me opened up
for about 10-12 yrs I volunteered to HELP any way possible, as lived near the trails, and NOT once did anyone from the club ever take me up on my offer
yet at every meeting I attended they complained about NO one ever helping or offering to help run a groomer or the likes
yet I DID! and so did several of my friends
it got very frustrating, so we STOPPED offering to help
we just went out and did what we could on our own, never got a thank you, and never asked for one
NOW, LAST 5+ yrs, I again started offering to HELP, offered to run a groomer,
helped out on more membership trail work days and all the while working the trails(tree trimming rock removal and re routes and such) all everyone working complained about is HOW The groomers are like a mafia , and that ALL the main guys that run them refuse to let anyone one join there CLUB, as they looked at grooming as THERE JOB< yet again they complained about being the ONLY one'
s running groomers and NOT getting seat time in on sleds
I even worked with the VP of the club and he too just complained about HOW The groomers wouldn;'t let anyone else run them
SO< there are CLICK in clubs that outsiders many times cannot get passed EVEN if willing to help

I know what all I have TRIED to help with(I have offered to use my equipment skid steers and tractors) offered MY time to use there's
spent many hours and days tree cutting(which I always loved, they would pick a DAY and time to meet up, then yap/BS for 2 yrs , cut tree's for 2 hrs and want to quit for the day, after I would drive 100+ miles to get there, for 2 hrs of work)
and then again her them complain about how so few members show up to help, or do work in the club

IN all my yrs as a club member here at THIS club, I have been ASKED twice to help, and most every time I did help, it was ME calling THEM asking if I could help THEM

SO< when folks say that club work is done by ONLY a few members
there are some other reasons this is that way too
its NOT just folks NOT wanting to help or do work
IN my area, it sure seems like the MAIN guys DON"T want help from others as there worried about loosing there CHIP on there shoulder about being able to bitch when there is snow and they have to run a groomer
OR a darn sure lack of the club contacting members and letting them know when work IS being done so MAYBE they can come and help
we ALL don't live close by to attend meetings
in THIS Modern age, when being able to reach people has never been easier
they can sure send out MASS emails asking for renewal $$$ or send me raffle tickets to sell for them(and I always sell extra's)
WHY cannot they send out MASS emails (or texts) asking for help when they have DATES for work to be done
as stated before, if things DON"T change/adapt to modern times, it will fail
and many folks at the top need to loose some of the attitude about being HIGH and mighty IMO
turning down help when offered doesn't get anything more done
Rant over LOL

 

[gary_in_neenah]

and I want to look him straight in the eye and I want to tell him what a cheap, lying, no-good, rotten, four-flushing, low-life, snake-licking, dirt-eating, inbred, overstuffed, ignorant, blood-sucking, dog-kissing, brainless, hopeless, heartless, fat-a$$, bug-eyed, stiff-legged, spotty-lipped, worm-headed sack of monkey
sh-t he is! Hallelujah! Holy sh-t! Where's the Tylenol?

Man, you guys have this Ranting Thing down to a science. I had to borrow one from Chevy Chase to keep up!

 

[scoot]

I been involved in this sport since the 70's
in the late 80's early 90's our first club near me opened up
for about 10-12 yrs I volunteered to HELP any way possible, as lived near the trails, and NOT once did anyone from the club ever take me up on my offer
yet at every meeting I attended they complained about NO one ever helping or offering to help run a groomer or the likes
yet I DID! and so did several of my friends
it got very frustrating, so we STOPPED offering to help
we just went out and did what we could on our own, never got a thank you, and never asked for one
NOW, LAST 5+ yrs, I again started offering to HELP, offered to run a groomer,
helped out on more membership trail work days and all the while working the trails(tree trimming rock removal and re routes and such) all everyone working complained about is HOW The groomers are like a mafia , and that ALL the main guys that run them refuse to let anyone one join there CLUB, as they looked at grooming as THERE JOB< yet again they complained about being the ONLY one'
s running groomers and NOT getting seat time in on sleds
I even worked with the VP of the club and he too just complained about HOW The groomers wouldn;'t let anyone else run them
SO< there are CLICK in clubs that outsiders many times cannot get passed EVEN if willing to help

I know what all I have TRIED to help with(I have offered to use my equipment skid steers and tractors) offered MY time to use there's
spent many hours and days tree cutting(which I always loved, they would pick a DAY and time to meet up, then yap/BS for 2 yrs , cut tree's for 2 hrs and want to quit for the day, after I would drive 100+ miles to get there, for 2 hrs of work)
and then again her them complain about how so few members show up to help, or do work in the club

IN all my yrs as a club member here at THIS club, I have been ASKED twice to help, and most every time I did help, it was ME calling THEM asking if I could help THEM

SO< when folks say that club work is done by ONLY a few members
there are some other reasons this is that way too
its NOT just folks NOT wanting to help or do work
IN my area, it sure seems like the MAIN guys DON"T want help from others as there worried about loosing there CHIP on there shoulder about being able to bitch when there is snow and they have to run a groomer
OR a darn sure lack of the club contacting members and letting them know when work IS being done so MAYBE they can come and help
we ALL don't live close by to attend meetings
in THIS Modern age, when being able to reach people has never been easier
they can sure send out MASS emails asking for renewal $$$ or send me raffle tickets to sell for them(and I always sell extra's)
WHY cannot they send out MASS emails (or texts) asking for help when they have DATES for work to be done
as stated before, if things DON"T change/adapt to modern times, it will fail
and many folks at the top need to loose some of the attitude about being HIGH and mighty IMO
turning down help when offered doesn't get anything more done
Rant over LOL

You quoted me like I'm part of your problem. So I'll ask. Why did you sit on your hands for twenty years and wait for someone else to start a club, then complain about how they ran it. The more clubs the better. Start one yourself. If you find the current clubs inadequate, and this goes for all the others who have issues with the "old guard" too. The old clubs are beginning to fade away so now's your time to step up to the plate or get off the pot. Start your own clubs and go to the association meetings so your clubs get a vote on how things should be done. Host your own fundraisers and such. Again, the more clubs the merrier. As you said, this is the modern age, so show the old timers how its done. And I bet you'll get your ride in the groomer. Or don't. Its easier to hate on the tired old clubs and buy a trail sticker.

 

[dothedoo]

But call me when the trails become family friendly enough so that my granddaughters on their ZR200s aren't afraid for their lives to ride them in public.
Rant off.

If I had your number, I'd call you to let you know that the trails are just as family friendly today, as they were 40 years ago.

 

[scoot]

If I had your number, I'd call you to let you know that the trails are just as family friendly today, as they were 40 years ago.

And sensible trail speed limits would be a start to making them safer.
Please know, any ruffled feathers that my posts may have caused are both welcome and purely intentional.

 

[ddhanna]

I been involved in this sport since the 70's
in the late 80's early 90's our first club near me opened up
for about 10-12 yrs I volunteered to HELP any way possible, as lived near the trails, and NOT once did anyone from the club ever take me up on my offer
yet at every meeting I attended they complained about NO one ever helping or offering to help run a groomer or the likes
yet I DID! and so did several of my friends
it got very frustrating, so we STOPPED offering to help
we just went out and did what we could on our own, never got a thank you, and never asked for one
NOW, LAST 5+ yrs, I again started offering to HELP, offered to run a groomer,
helped out on more membership trail work days and all the while working the trails(tree trimming rock removal and re routes and such) all everyone working complained about is HOW The groomers are like a mafia , and that ALL the main guys that run them refuse to let anyone one join there CLUB, as they looked at grooming as THERE JOB< yet again they complained about being the ONLY one'
s running groomers and NOT getting seat time in on sleds
I even worked with the VP of the club and he too just complained about HOW The groomers wouldn;'t let anyone else run them
SO< there are CLICK in clubs that outsiders many times cannot get passed EVEN if willing to help

I know what all I have TRIED to help with(I have offered to use my equipment skid steers and tractors) offered MY time to use there's
spent many hours and days tree cutting(which I always loved, they would pick a DAY and time to meet up, then yap/BS for 2 yrs , cut tree's for 2 hrs and want to quit for the day, after I would drive 100+ miles to get there, for 2 hrs of work)
and then again her them complain about how so few members show up to help, or do work in the club

IN all my yrs as a club member here at THIS club, I have been ASKED twice to help, and most every time I did help, it was ME calling THEM asking if I could help THEM

SO< when folks say that club work is done by ONLY a few members
there are some other reasons this is that way too
its NOT just folks NOT wanting to help or do work
IN my area, it sure seems like the MAIN guys DON"T want help from others as there worried about loosing there CHIP on there shoulder about being able to bitch when there is snow and they have to run a groomer
OR a darn sure lack of the club contacting members and letting them know when work IS being done so MAYBE they can come and help
we ALL don't live close by to attend meetings
in THIS Modern age, when being able to reach people has never been easier
they can sure send out MASS emails asking for renewal $$$ or send me raffle tickets to sell for them(and I always sell extra's)
WHY cannot they send out MASS emails (or texts) asking for help when they have DATES for work to be done
as stated before, if things DON"T change/adapt to modern times, it will fail
and many folks at the top need to loose some of the attitude about being HIGH and mighty IMO
turning down help when offered doesn't get anything more done
Rant over LOL

Maybe they just don't like ranting....

 

[dothedoo]

And sensible trail speed limits would be a start to making them safer.
Please know, any ruffled feathers that my posts may have caused are both welcome and purely intentional.

I'll go along with a speed limit, if we also enact an age limit.

....as in, nobody over 65 on the trails.