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Yamaha's contract with Cat up this year (2019)
- Thread starter shelby369
- Start date
yea funny s**t
bearrassler
Well-known member
That is a common misconception, Bombardier unloaded the sleds, watercraft, and groomers years ago, it has nothing to do with BRP anymore, the main company that was involved in the buyout was Bain Capital, think Mitt Romney
Not sure what you mean. Textron total assets 14 billion. Bombardier total assets 25 billion.
Actually you're the one that is incorrect...Bombardier hasn't owned BRP for a number of years now....yes, they are larger when you consider the railway and aviation industries but that has no relation to BRP now. In the grand scheme of things BRP is relatively minuscule currently.
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... I don't know details but I can tell you Yamaha snowmobiles aren't going anywhere. They're not getting out of the businessI've said it a million times but people continue to not believe it. It is what it is. We need all four sled companies and they aren't going anywhere. Amen for that!
My thoughts are would Yamaha really have spent all the R&D $$$ to design the 998 turbo and electronics from the ground up only to abandon that market segment before recouping their investment? I personally think not.
The R&D expenses are sunk costs....history...
All that really matters is the answer to the question “can the business be profitable on an ongoing basis.”
I the answer is no, it’s best to cut your losses and make no further investments, no matter what you spent in the past.
If the ship is sinking, it doesn’t matter that you spent money painting the hull last year.
All that really matters is the answer to the question “can the business be profitable on an ongoing basis.”
I the answer is no, it’s best to cut your losses and make no further investments, no matter what you spent in the past.
If the ship is sinking, it doesn’t matter that you spent money painting the hull last year.
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?????????????? SideWinder/TCat very limited market. Yami, and AC knew that very well going into it. They are ultra fast, and do what they do very well. The 998 is a get-r-done deal for sure. However, they are very limited in numbers of market share, as compared to overall sales. Not much else you can do with the 998 turbo either, other than rocketship type sled due to it's weight, and cost factor.
Just because Sidewinder and Thundercat does not appeal to you an Ace rider doesn’t mean both models didn’t sell well. I don’t know those volume numbers but Pat’s sells a bunch each year and I see plenty on the trails in WI and MI. I will agree I don’t need 180 to 200 ponies but I use all of my Apex 165hp and don’t want more. I did test ride a SW at Pat’s and I liked it and the engine a lot but a load to steer without eps. The overall market has shifted from 600s to 800s and 850s that’s a fact so I think your wrong that big hp is a limited market. I do think Yamaha has a hole 130ish Viper with next step 180-200 Hp Sidewinder a tweener sled at 150 to 165 would have high appeal to me and many others.
You got me wrong whitedust. I did not say the SW/TC's didn't sell well. And I was not running the SW/TC down, but just tried to say they are very good at what they are, and do. But the ultra high hp, very high speed, and very high cost sleds will always be low volume market share as compared to over all sales. Just the way it is, and always has been. Plus that market segment saturates fast. 800/850 2-stroke market is a totally different deal. Not even comparable, apples, and oranges. 800/850 more overall appeal, and thus numbers sold. I'm like you, no need or want of that ultra class sled. I do lots of miles, and do it with comfort to enjoy my ride. Perhaps 40 years ago, yes, a different time in my life. But for those who need, want the "ultra" speed, SW/TC is the ride to have!
Abe have you ridden a Thundercat or Sidewinder? Believe it or not those engines are very friendly at every speed and style of riding nothing like the old 90s Tcat and Storm that were all on or off with power surges instead very even spool up and down of the current turbo. It is very nice to have extra ponies there at your becken call use it or not. It may do you well to log some miles on a SW give it an open mind acceptance rather than catalog it is you often do as nothing more than a rocket ship.
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I'm going to take it that you intended ThunderCat, not Firecat? Real big difference in many ways to those two sleds, totally different characters there for sure. I did not mean to project that SW/TC's are only good for ultra high speed, WOT. They are real nice rides. Much better to me than my friends Apex, as I like the rider forward position. But they're something else to steer imo. I rode many miles with a Winder in Canada March of 17. Not intending harm here, but the guy was worn pretty darn good after a hard, big mile day. And, he didn't enjoy the fresh deep snow ride day either, as it was a shorty sled. Thus, low mpg's too. Many close calls with the pucker brush. I for one don't understand the short track thing, but he was all for no speed sacrifice what so ever? So, I may be wrong, but I still am of the belief that the most of the SW/TC sleds are bought for the want, and need of the "rush" of speed. They will for sure deliver on that, and do so very, very fast!
For all 4 oem’s they can’t just rely on the lastest and greatest most expensive. If they want a future they need to always have under 10k sleds availabile. Doo, and poo do a good job at this. Yamaha definitely not, idk now if cat offers a 600 class sled in this price range. I think they might offer a 4 stroke lawn mower type (3000)??
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Guest
Nobody needs power steering on a sidewinder if it is set up right. The first thing to do is take off the stock skis and throw them away. Then get a 15 year old BRP 6.9 ski or any rocker type ski. Set your front spring on the rear suspesion to its sweet spot and ride. The procross chassis is heads and shoulders above any Apex in any length. It is not even close. I have had both. You could not give me an Apex.
Well I convinced myself I’m better off exiting this discussion as it seems like nothing but pot shots at Yamaha and their products. For me I like all OEMs and their products but Yamaha is my fav and luv my Apex xtx and ride it all over WI and the UPMI. My buds all ride Apex xtx and no one has any complaints. Others have Vipers and Sidewinders and they like those models too. The Apex seem to be more reliable than the Yamacats in our experience but all sleds break at sometime in their lifetime. So beat on Yamaha if you must but I believe Yamaha is going to stay in the snowmobile business just as Yamaha Corporate has stated. I also think other OEMs will have their own inventory reduction programs after another low snow winter. I also need to add all brands are welcome to ride with us anytime but for some unknown reason we are an all Yamaha group so we have lots of experience with Yamaha sleds.
I would have to agree with you grub taking it as you are very well experienced at setting up a sled properly. And, I believe you have a SW. The guy we were with in Canada, was not a very well, mechanical minded when it comes to setting up a sled, let alone a ultra high performance SW. Ski's were the biggest problem, and he had no sense about how to adjust his ski shocks, and, or the front of the skid.
whitedust, I intended no pot shots at anyone, not Yamaha, or any others. And by all means, everyone should ride what they like, and prefer. Brand, and model, as that's the only way for total ride enjoyment. However, I will admit, I got sucked into the Yamaha is going to bring out a "new, totally all Yamaha", snowmobile 6 years ago, or so. I was wanting to give the 4 stroke a try, and figured this " something all new, all Yami" would be the ticket. My riding bud was a Yami guy for many, many years. Well, no dice on that all "new"deal! And so, I am now very skeptical of Yamaha staying in the snowmobile business, let alone ever building a "new, all Yamaha" sled ever again. As to me, Yamaha doesn't appear to have any want at all to do so. However, AC is do for a new platform/chassis? That will probably be the deciding factor for Yami, as themselves being in, or out, as a snowmobile brand. Jmo, no harm, or pot shots intended at anyone.
gogebic_sledder
Member
It’s coming
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Guest
According to snowtech yami is patenting carbon fiber components. They look a lot like Pro Cross parts. Also the mock up looks like a three cylinder format. So it will be the same thing only lighter and will be the first sled to retail for over 20 thou. And I will bet anybody it will still come with garbage skis.