2021 Doo

[tsg]

Post may have been mis-interpreted or misworded, as I know the Ski Doo 4 strokes are in demand and great units, just was stating they did not expand the line, create new variations, ..... Assume production will just be increased? Also, curious why Ski doo 4 strokes are in such demand. From what I have noticed, others do not seem to be as "wanted". Is that a correct assumption?

 

[Attak man]

Post may have been mis-interpreted or misworded, as I know the Ski Doo 4 strokes are in demand and great units, just was stating they did not expand the line, create new variations, ..... Assume production will just be increased? Also, curious why Ski doo 4 strokes are in such demand. From what I have noticed, others do not seem to be as "wanted". Is that a correct assumption?

I don't know....Minocqua Yamaha SOLD all of the Sidewinders they had last year, and I know Pat's has sold ALOT of Sidewinders, and Vipers (the past few seasons)...the Ski-doo Aces are just nice, quiet, economical machines..perfect for most trail riders..IMO ski doo hit the meat of the market perfectly...There are many people who don't want 130 plus hp sled...that simply enjoy cruising trails. Most of our ace buyers, are older riders, women, and people who are new to the sport.
They want low maintenance, reliable sleds. Yamaha started the trend, and ski doo expanded it, and hit the target better....and have built quite a following.

 

[old abe]

I don't know....Minocqua Yamaha SOLD all of the Sidewinders they had last year, and I know Pat's has sold ALOT of Sidewinders, and Vipers (the past few seasons)...the Ski-doo Aces are just nice, quiet, economical machines..perfect for most trail riders..IMO ski doo hit the meat of the market perfectly...There are many people who don't want 130 plus hp sled...that simply enjoy cruising trails. Most of our ace buyers, are older riders, women, and people who are new to the sport.
They want low maintenance, reliable sleds. Yamaha started the trend, and ski doo expanded it, and hit the target better....and have built quite a following.

Spot on Attak Man! Many Apex riders now very much like the 900T as their replacement, and for a better ride. Doo did not "steal" anything, they just produce sleds that people like, want, and buy. Nothing secret about that. If you build something very few want, good luck with that! I bought the 900 Ace Rene for my wife, not ever thinking how I would come to enjoy riding it so very, very, much.

 

[Attak man]

Spot on Attak Man! Many Apex riders now very much like the 900T as their replacement, and for a better ride. Doo did not "steal" anything, they just produce sleds that people like, want, and buy. Nothing secret about that. If you build something very few want, good luck with that! I bought the 900 Ace Rene for my wife, not ever thinking how I would come to enjoy riding it so very, very, much.

Same here...I have nearly 1,400 miles on my buddy's 2014 900 ace tnt ... I have had a blast on it, and have averaged nearly 20 mpg (running it hard)...granted it doesn't have the mid to top end burst of my beloved apexes, but it does everything else 3 times better (ride , handling etc)...I had no problem riding with bigger faster sleds on wooded trails...only on the railrode grades, and lakes do u get left behind.....if it had just a bit more upper mid range and top end (closer to the 1200)...it would hands down be my favorite snowmobile...I wouldn't even want a turbo....if one can swallow their ego, and just try one for a day....I think they'd be impressed....I loved my yamaha 4 strokes...but ski doo is making some awesome 4 strokes right now...and you are right, many apex riders have bought 900 turbos...they are the perfect up grade from an apex..basically ski doo beat yamaha to the punch, and built the better apex in the 900 T

 

[old abe]

Same here...I have nearly 1,400 miles on my buddy's 2014 900 ace tnt ... I have had a blast on it, and have averaged nearly 20 mpg (running it hard)...granted it doesn't have the mid to top end burst of my beloved apexes, but it does everything else 3 times better (ride , handling etc)...I had no problem riding with bigger faster sleds on wooded trails...only on the railrode grades, and lakes do u get left behind.....if it had just a bit more upper mid range and top end (closer to the 1200)...it would hands down be my favorite snowmobile...I wouldn't even want a turbo....if one can swallow their ego, and just try one for a day....I think they'd be impressed....I loved my yamaha 4 strokes...but ski doo is making some awesome 4 strokes right now...and you are right, many apex riders have bought 900 turbos...they are the perfect up grade from an apex..basically ski doo beat yamaha to the punch, and built the better apex in the 900 T

As I said, Doo didn't steal, or take anything. They just did what Yamaha chose not to do. Such as building their "all new, all Yamaha, snowmobile. Instead, they gave us a line of BS.

 

[Attak man]

As I said, Doo didn't steal, or take anything. They just did what Yamaha chose not to do. Such as building their "all new, all Yamaha, snowmobile. Instead, they gave us a line of BS.

X2...Got tired of waiting...will be on ski doo...I don't need or want a BNG Viper (on a 10 year old chassis) with all kinds of trick gadgets (perfume on a PIG) that don't make it ride or handle as well as a DOO.

 

[1fujifilm]

Ah, yeah, well, they forgot how to make snowmobiles a long time back now also, eh? Or perhaps this, they then decided they no longer wanted to, or they did not know how to produce viable snowmobiles! Yes, Yamaha, sucked me into believe their talk about the "all new, all Yamaha snowmobile" that they would produce for a few years. And, then having come to find out they never intended to do so? But never again will they get me to believe any of their BS! Won't happen!

Yamaha sure likes to roll out new motorcycle models nobody wants, mehlennials; poop they ain't buying poop.

Bear

- - - Updated - - -

Same here...I have nearly 1,400 miles on my buddy's 2014 900 ace tnt ... I have had a blast on it, and have averaged nearly 20 mpg (running it hard)...granted it doesn't have the mid to top end burst of my beloved apexes, but it does everything else 3 times better (ride , handling etc)...I had no problem riding with bigger faster sleds on wooded trails...only on the railrode grades, and lakes do u get left behind.....if it had just a bit more upper mid range and top end (closer to the 1200)...it would hands down be my favorite snowmobile...I wouldn't even want a turbo....if one can swallow their ego, and just try one for a day....I think they'd be impressed....I loved my yamaha 4 strokes...but ski doo is making some awesome 4 strokes right now...and you are right, many apex riders have bought 900 turbos...they are the perfect up grade from an apex..basically ski doo beat yamaha to the punch, and built the better apex in the 900 T

Being a Doo dealer employee, what do you think of the "non-ITC"?
I didn't care for it.

Bear

 

[gogebic_sledder]

No doubt Doo makes a good sled. However, the lack of an LED headlight 6 years after they first came out is a real head scratcher. The only reason has to be selling those aftermarket LED lights, can't be anything else.

I have Sii led bulbs on all my skidoo’s their excellent. Under $150. Fanboys on dootalk will say they don’t project the light properly. I would never go back, best after market money I’ve ever spent. I keep them mostly on low beam, high beam is ridiculous.

 

[Attak man]

Non ITC? I'm confused...the only non itc I've driven was an older 1200...everything else is itc that I've been on.

 

[snoden]

ITC is good for the casual trail cruiser rider. The aggressive trail riders don't care for it too much, that hesitation is annoying. The turbo lag on the 900t is very noticeable as well, just doesn't spool up as fast as the sidewinder turbo. My riding bud has an 18 1200 and 20 900t so I know what they feel like first hand. The front end waddles to much as well on the 900t, wont hold its line in whooped out trails. It's very unpredictable where as the procross front end is planted and very predictable. Still its a very nice option and a quality sled for many just not for me.

 

[old abe]

ITC is good for the casual trail cruiser rider. The aggressive trail riders don't care for it too much, that hesitation is annoying. The turbo lag on the 900t is very noticeable as well, just doesn't spool up as fast as the sidewinder turbo. My riding bud has an 18 1200 and 20 900t so I know what they feel like first hand. The front end waddles to much as well on the 900t, wont hold its line in whooped out trails. It's very unpredictable where as the procross front end is planted and very predictable. Still its a very nice option and a quality sled for many just not for me.

You need to stick with your Yamaha's, as they are in need of buyers. I have never had any hesitation in "sport" mode.

 

[whitedust]

Ski Doo knows what they are doing, regardless of what people on here say or think, or in general. I have Ski Doo and Polaris sleds, and though I am not too excited about the new colors, some features or lack of, extra costs for the new dash, there will be people buying 2021 sleds, perhaps me included. People can also bitch about lack of LED lights, things like that, but most of those same people will spend money on extra accessories, many unneeded, put cans on, other unneeded accessories, so people can and will spend money how they want. Who cares.

In looking at the Ski Doo lineup, one trend that no one can deny are that 4 stroke sleds are not as "desired" or "necessary" as people seem to think. In the latest Supertrax it was reported that Ski Doo over the past few years, in each of those years, has sold more 4 strokes then Cat or Yamaha combined. Would this not imply that Ski Doo may know more than the others, and that their current 4 stroke offerings are enough to satisfy the masses? Yes, reduction in production by others was a factor, but that was by choice and necessity, as Yamaha and Cat know they had unsold, unwanted inventory, ultimately affecting their bottom line and future goals. Understand that bigger does not mean better, but in this industry, sure seems like the biggest 2 know what they are doing, and seem to offer the most innovation and variety, with innovation being interpreted in a number of different ways.

Ok with what Ski Doo has done, and excited to see what Polaris has to offer and perhaps Yamaha from a 2 stroke standpoint. For me, 2 strokes have evolved and improved immensely over the years, so that is where my interest level remains. Plus, I am a hi mileage rider at 56 years old, and realize that i am not old enough yet to move to a 4 stroke.

Don’t get excited about a Yamaha 2s those engineers left a long time ago. Skidoo is about choices both both 2s and 4s niche market hp engines that the masses like. Doo has no problem selling all their 4s inventory each year Yamaha too much hp old procross chassis presents hold over problems for them. I have no idea why Textron supplies Yamaha sleds 1 day that will be over and dual branded sleds has become old an unattractive to me. It’s difficult to even follow Yamaha now days just watch AC and wait for the blue graphics with the same old 4s engines. Doos colors don’t appeal to me but I’m a basic black and red sled buyer. Polaris is a 2s sled company and they don’t care about the 4s market but they do well with their lineup.

 

[snoden]

You need to stick with your Yamaha's, as they are in need of buyers. I have never had any hesitation in "sport" mode.

No need to be offensive abe. Like I said for the trail cruiser it is just fine in sport mode. If your cruising along and need to hit the flipper to lift the front end over a whoop it has a hesitation. That's just my observation that's all but I think many more believe this to be true as well. Im a 4 stroke guy and loved the 1200 before ITC came on the scene. When it was time to upgrade the sidewinder was a better fit for me. These are just my opinions so relax.

 

[Attak man]

I think the lag is a non issue...the magazine guys made a big deal out of it, and people are parrotting what they read....the non ITC sleds seem more jumpy to me. I agree that it's more pronounced on the Turbo, but like anything else, you get used to it after some seat time and it becomes a non issue (IMO every snowmobile has a personality)....I really like the ITC....I love the sport mode on the 900. and eco mode makes it really easy to load and unload. I think the front end "waddling" or "not holding it's line"...depends more on the skis you have, and what set up you are running...because I can put you on a turbo, that absolutely rails corners (the TS skis can cause the handling issue you describe, my least favorite ski right now)

 

[snoden]

The lag is very noticeable when switching from a Sidewinder and 900t back and forth. Not sure how much boost the 900t has from the factory but it seems a little on the low end. I suppose if I rode an ITC sled all the time I would get used to it more and learn its personality better. Overall it is a very nice machine and you may be right on the skis as they were stock skis. Thanks for your input Attak!

 

[dfattack]

Doo did not "steal" anything, they just produce sleds that people like, want, and buy.

Exactly, Yamaha "pushed" me away. I still am an Apex owner. Been waiting for a replacement for years now. I used to buy one sled a year. My son bought one in 2015, but other than that the last sled I bought for me was an Apex XTX in 2012 and a 2013 Venture GT to ride with my wife. Just sold one of two XTX's (2011) and still have my 2012. I'm lining up to buy 3 Doo's in the next two years. This year two, My son is buying one and ditching the never ending mechanical issues with his 2015 Viper and a grand touring. Next year one for me to replace my XTX.

 

[Attak man]

Exactly, Yamaha "pushed" me away. I still am an Apex owner. Been waiting for a replacement for years now. I used to buy one sled a year. My son bought one in 2015, but other than that the last sled I bought for me was an Apex XTX in 2012 and a 2013 Venture GT to ride with my wife. Just sold one of two XTX's (2011) and still have my 2012. I'm lining up to buy 3 Doo's in the next two years. This year two, My son is buying one and ditching the never ending mechanical issues with his 2015 Viper and a grand touring. Next year one for me to replace my XTX.

Well come see us at the Sports Center...WE have a 2020 900 turbo Enduro (red), and a 2020 Black Turbo Renegade...Talk to Mike or Neil, I'm sure he will work out a great deal on these...they are our last two 4 strokes on the lot.

 

[1fujifilm]

Non ITC? I'm confused...the only non itc I've driven was an older 1200...everything else is itc that I've been on.

Sorry, I didn't let everyone in on the joke; non-ITC is a joke that the throttle is really "not-intelligent".
I base my opinion on on one ride a few years back on a rental from Munising Budget-Host. I came off a 600 E-Tec and rode my friends 900 Renegade rental. I put on 20 miles near Paradise, MI and couldn't find a mode that was able to duplicate what riders were used to with a cable throttle (instant throttle input). For what it's worth, I don't like it on my Wife's Highlander either; they both leave you "flat-footed" if you expect instant engagement. It's worse on the car though as the software has to tell the car to both accelerate and downshift the transmission too.

Bear

 

[old abe]

No need to be offensive abe. Like I said for the trail cruiser it is just fine in sport mode. If your cruising along and need to hit the flipper to lift the front end over a whoop it has a hesitation. That's just my observation that's all but I think many more believe this to be true as well. Im a 4 stroke guy and loved the 1200 before ITC came on the scene. When it was time to upgrade the sidewinder was a better fit for me. These are just my opinions so relax.

No pun, harm intended snoden700! It was easy to read you are a SW Yami guy. And that's good, as I believe in to each his own! And have always said, ride what YOU like, and enjoy! No one else matters. Again, I have never had hesitation in "sport" mode, Standard, and Eco, yes. And, imo, the non itc throttle 1200 is not as appealing as the itc 1200 as being ride friendly. I rode with a SW for a couple of days the year before last in Ontario. On all day ride, you're always ready for a break on that beast.

 

[snobuilder]

The Doo rationalization is cult like.