Was going to pull the clutches on my 18 cat 600. Has 8K on it. Figured I'd clean them and at least change the springs. I haven't done any maintenance on them in the past. My last sled was an 06 Poo 600, and I dropped the clutches at Goodwin at a similar mileage and had them go through them, and if I remember right they changed the weights and pins also. I thought I'd try to go through them myself this time, but I'm wondering what I should be looking for in terms of wear. I've watched some videos but thought I'd check here. Thanks.
Clutch maintenance - worn parts
- Thread starter Hoosier
- Start date
SledTL
Active member
While you have the secondary off you should pick the seal on the jack shaft bearing and clean it out/repack it. I would do that especially if you have not had it replaced on the sled yet at that mileage. Same goes for the driveshaft behind the brake rotor but that is a significantly more challenging one to do and I didnt ever complete it. If you need guidance there is lots of posts on TY4stroke or I could share all of my pictures with you as its a procross chassis thing.
Thanks. I have the bearing to go on the driveshaft. Been meaning to do that for a couple years. Actually bought the bearing and the BOP repair kit suggested on ty4stroke, depending on what the shaft looks like. I haven't heard of many failings on the jackshaft but I'll look at adding grease to that too. Would rather not pull that to change it if I can avoid it.
600_RMK_144
Active member
Clutches are one of those areas I'm not super comfortable with other than taking them off (water trick works every time!), putting them on and changing springs/weights. I clean the surfaces before every trip, but beyond that I don't have the knowledge to mess with them. We put on maybe 500-800 miles a season and have them serviced every Fall. Drop them (both primary & secondary) at the Thunder Products Clutching booth at Hay Days. They clean them up good and check for anything not within tolerances and send em' back. We get a call if there are any parts needing to be replaced. Probably overkill to do every season given our low miles. Guess it's one of those things I'd rather be safe than sorry.
SledTL
Active member
Here is what my jackshaft bearing looked like on my Viper at 3200 miles. I didnt have any problems with it, but I felt alot more at ease knowing I cleaned it up and put some new grease in it. Make sure not to overpack it if you do it!
Excellent choice with Goodwin Performance Hoosier!
Thanks for the picture. I haven't taken the seal off a bearing before. I would have thought it wouldn't go back in easily but apparently it does. I changed the skid bearings not too long ago and kept the one that were smooth. I could practice on one of those.
I'm thinking I'll keep this sled for 2 more seasons and possibly keep it for my kids after that.
I'll start looking into that. I saw my current team clutch is now replaced by the adapt clutch, and the price is fairly reasonable. If I see any issues I may look into that. Of course the pins and weights would be extra either way.
favoritos
Well-known member
There isn't a whole lot you easily can rebuild on the Team clutch. Weights and springs are the basic parts that can be swapped. Tower buttons aren't too bad. There are kits on the market that include a full set of bushings, pins, and buttons. I would stick to anything spider related. Even that might be a deal breaker once you try removing the spider.
I'm not saying the rest is impossible, but the effort and expense eats up the rewards.
The roller bushings are one of the early signs it's pooped. They can be replaced by breaking down the clutch and pressing out the pins. Success is so so. The pins are probably almost fused in place. Pressing them out often galls the holes. Doing the main shaft bearing is another tricky process. The roller bearing is not caged.
@Hoosier , I'm bummed you didn't pose the question earlier. I just threw my last Team into the scrap bin last week. It was in decent shape and you could have had it for free. It just got caught up in my spring cleaning binge. This long spring has produced a lot of cleaning.
Anyhow, there are a couple reasons I was willing to toss a working clutch. I've been converting to ADAPT primaries and I didn't have anything left running the Team. Not that I'm recommending going that route. It was just easier in my case with a fleet of new and old sleds. I try to keep the parts bin simple as possible.
The other reason is a big deal. Look at pricing of a brand new primary. You can get into a Team for decent money. It would be the easy route if your clutch is tired.
I'm not saying the rest is impossible, but the effort and expense eats up the rewards.
The roller bushings are one of the early signs it's pooped. They can be replaced by breaking down the clutch and pressing out the pins. Success is so so. The pins are probably almost fused in place. Pressing them out often galls the holes. Doing the main shaft bearing is another tricky process. The roller bearing is not caged.
@Hoosier , I'm bummed you didn't pose the question earlier. I just threw my last Team into the scrap bin last week. It was in decent shape and you could have had it for free. It just got caught up in my spring cleaning binge. This long spring has produced a lot of cleaning.
Anyhow, there are a couple reasons I was willing to toss a working clutch. I've been converting to ADAPT primaries and I didn't have anything left running the Team. Not that I'm recommending going that route. It was just easier in my case with a fleet of new and old sleds. I try to keep the parts bin simple as possible.
The other reason is a big deal. Look at pricing of a brand new primary. You can get into a Team for decent money. It would be the easy route if your clutch is tired.
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That's too bad you just chucked it!
The only trip I went on this year was to the snowies, and I did put different weights in it for that. The pins came out easily enough. Are the roller bushings the part in the spider that the weight pins go into?
I won't know much until I can get at my sled and pull the clutches and see what they look like. Then I'll probably have some more questions
. Hopefully in the next few weeks. Obviously I have time but I want to get after that so I'm not scrambling in the Fall.
favoritos
Well-known member
Weight pins are into the sheave assembly. Those are cake compared to working on the spider.
It is not a small project if you go that deep into a rebuild.
8,000 miles are a lot, but you never know. I'd check your rollers before deciding on anything. If the rollers are good, check slop in the sheave bushings. If it's still smooth and tight, I'd leave it alone.
It is not a small project if you go that deep into a rebuild.
8,000 miles are a lot, but you never know. I'd check your rollers before deciding on anything. If the rollers are good, check slop in the sheave bushings. If it's still smooth and tight, I'd leave it alone.
SledTL
Active member
Just use a very small flat head screw driver to work around the outer edge of the seal. I believe the inner part has a metal spring that helps it ride on the inner race better. Clean it out with WD-40, and lightly dry it with compressed air. Don't hit it too hard or it will blow out the backside seal. Re-pack it with some wheel bearing grease and then use your fingers to get the seal back in. Be careful to not overpack the bearing as the balls can skid and heat up causing just as much damage. You might already know this, but for others who might see this and have questions.
favoritos
Well-known member
I've also done that bearing.
The small screwdriver works great. It helps to have a small angle pick to sneak around the seal when you start. That will make it easier to start the screwdriver blade.
I like using a needle tip on the gun and squirt grease inside the bearing.
Just a heads up. I did over fill the first one with that method. The needle tip puts a lot of grease inside the bearing. I was concerned and ran the sled on a stand to check. I had some oozing around the seal so I popped the seal again and wiped some grease out.
The small screwdriver works great. It helps to have a small angle pick to sneak around the seal when you start. That will make it easier to start the screwdriver blade.
I like using a needle tip on the gun and squirt grease inside the bearing.
Just a heads up. I did over fill the first one with that method. The needle tip puts a lot of grease inside the bearing. I was concerned and ran the sled on a stand to check. I had some oozing around the seal so I popped the seal again and wiped some grease out.
indy_500
Well-known member
Definitely overkill! Other than springs, I wouldn’t touch a mountain sled clutch until 1500 miles or a trail sled clutch until 3000 miles.
Hoosier, I agree Goodwin is a good place to start, have used them for a few different things from clutches to shock rebuilds and always had great luck. I have rebuilt about a dozen Poo clutches in my lifetime. Have to be careful with a lot of aftermarket rebuild kits as they are not same quality as oem parts (that they won’t offer in a kit to rebuild…) Clutches are NOT difficult to work with, but they take a hefty amount of tools to be able to work on and the tools are pricey. If you’re not going to be rebuilding a clutch at least every other year I wouldn’t bother investing in them and let someone else take care of it. Just my 2 cents.
Appreciate it. I was thinking just changing springs (and weights and pins if it needs it), but if it needs more than that, then I'd probably let someone else handle it. I did end up with some adjustable weights that we used at the snowies. The range of those weights covers the flatland weight so I think I could use those if the stock weights are worn. I did wonder about the quality of them since they are adjustable but are still cheaper than OEM.
SledTL
Active member
Yea I just used a small amount with my finger to press in. I was more concerned about getting the belt dust cleaned out, and just having some in there more than none. Now that I have comfort with it, could easily check on it in future years.
What size engine is in your Cat Hoosier? I was not a ware there were adjustable weights available for 600 size engines that would range from flatland elevation all the way up to 8K to 10K? Usually the ramps effect that much change also? I don't mean to be nosy, but curious what source you got them from? Larger size engines don't seem to be effected near as much in my experience?
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Funny you ask since I ended up getting the wrong ones, but didn't know it until we were up on the hill and installing them in the trailer. We kind of decided to go west at the last minute, and a bud I ride with has a similar sled and called a shop that did a reflash for him before to ask about what weights we needed. They sent us weights - the brand is SSI but we didn't buy them direct. They come in two ranges. Mine would have worked better with the lighter version.
Mine's a 600. Stock flatland calls for 68 grams. 6-9K feet is 62. Over 9K is 58 plus a different spring. The adjustable weights they sent are 64 - 86, so I ran them without any added weights at 64. They should have sent us the weights that run from 55 - 71. The sled did ok but definitely struggled at the higher elevations. Snowies has quite a bit of variation and I could definitely tell when the weights were closer to where they needed to be and when they weren't.
I wasn't part of the conversation with the shop so I don't want to throw them under the bus, but basically they sent us the wrong weights but I used them, so now I'm stuck with them. The upside would be I can set them up for the correct flatland weights if my stock weights are worn.
I wish I would have done my own research before leaving but I figured it was taken care of with the shop knowing what to do. I didn't even see the weights until we got out there and I was comparing them to the owners manual.
Live and learn I guess - we had a great trip and other than trying to climb anything at high elevations it did ok, and it was the only time I got out on the snow this pathetic season...
lofsfire
Active member
I did not know it was possible to get in here and close everything back up again either! Thanks for the tips!