anonomoose
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olsmann;...f my wife is home alone and some big methed up dude kicks the door in and all she has is a 22 said:
Pocket Pistol for Concealed Carry
- Thread starter rvrbum4
- Start date
I think you're grasping at straws here.
And, I humbly submit, the marksmanship of the average CPL holder. I contend that a slightly off-target shot with a larger caliber is likely to do more to stop or at least delay a baddy than a slightly off-target shot with a .22. And you can't compare a poacher to a CPL holder.....sure, a .22 will kill a human, and a deer. But a poacher has plenty of time to set up a shot, likely with a rest and with a high-powered scope. A person in a self-defense situation have neither of those options.
And when they hit a substantial bone structure?
Sorry Moose, we'll just have to agree to disagree. Yeah, I'd take a .22 over nothing (and have) but it wouldn't be my first choice (or second, or third, or fourth, and so on) for self-defense. On that note, I think we've strayed pretty far from the intent of the original subject....so I've said my piece, and shall gracefully bow out of this path. Don't worry though, I still ardently support your candidacy as Lenny's VP!
I like my Sig P238 .380 it came with the rosewood grips and the laser mounted to the trigger guard. I took the laser off (less bulk) and less to think about in a high stress situation. I carry it in a Blackjack #3 pocket holsteer in a front pocket and can barely tell its there. Would like the xtra punch of a 9mm but this thing is so easy to carry and shoots awesome.
It was in my 20s & I'm fast on my feet know how to use my hands & have training. It was late at night at a MCds parking lot northwest side of Chicago. I was helping a young married couple friends of mine giving them my spare tire since their spare was flat. A bunch of punks pull up ask her husband what he is looking at & next thing I know words are exchanged & I have a circle of 6 guys trying to throw haymakers at me. They would windup I would move they hit nothing but air & I kept moving in & out. Lucky for me they were not organized 1 would come in & miss then I would hit whoever was in reach & move out. Meantime my friend's wife called the party we were at only a few houses away & help arrived in mass quickly & punks ran off. Only one guy nicked me while I was moving back a bit of a fat lip but no real damage. Now if somebody had a gun there would have been many bodies & mass shooting so happy no guns were involved but the best is yet to come.lol We went back to the party & host starts pulling out every gun he had & everyone was silly drunk. Gathered up my girlfriend & drove back to her place to spend the night I didn't want me or her to be around drunk people with guns. Glad I left since punks came back broke out all the windows on my buds brand new GTO. I heard it got crazy after that drunk friends loaded guys with guns in cars & started looking for the punks. Good thing they didn't find them. To me guns are for hunting & wars baseball bats & clubs are for punks that are stupid enough to give me trouble & fit well under bed, in car & sled no problem. Yes there are bad guys in this world but smarter to use words then hands if I have to but I sure don't need the hassle of shooting some idiot in public. Just ask George Zimmerman what a dumb a$$!
rocketman356
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jerkbait_1075
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Concealed Carry is a choice and decision for each individual to make.
Whitedust I respect your views about the issue but your views are very different than mine.
Even as a Law Enforcement Officer with 19 years on the job I strongly support a citizens right to carry.
For me I could not imagine a more helpless feeling to than hiding under the table at Denny's when some Jacka#$ decides to rob the joint. Sure even though its just a simple robbery and so long as he doesn't start shooting at the clerk or anybody else I would never get involved in a gun fight in a scenario like that but just imagining the sheer feeling of helplessness as you sit there cowering, huddled under the table praying that he doesn't hurt you???? That scenario isnt for me.... For somebody else who isnt confident about the responsibilities of concealed carry it may be.
For me Its about managing the "what if's". What if I am at a shopping mall, resturant, school event, broke down along side the roadway, ect., ect.
And you are correct in your assessment of George Zimmerman. There was a goof that went looking for a conflict. I would argue though that there are very few (in fact I am suprised by the lack of citizen concealed carry shoots) since the vast majoritity of the US has implemented concealed carry. I think that is a testament to the majority of americans being responsible gun owners.
I will say that as a police officer, since concealled carry laws went into effect I have always worried about arriving at a "hot" shooting scene in a public setting where a citizen is engaged in taking action. There is no time to determine who the bad guy is as a Police Officer when you arrive. Person(s) with a gun upon arrival have a very real chance of taking gunfire from a police officer. It is your duty as a police officer to determine who the bad guy is and not simply "spray" Bullets at everybody and all police officers would do diligence to do so but I still believe its just a matter of time until, unfortunatly, there is a tragedy where a good samaritian is shot by a well intentioned cop. Its gonna happen mark my words. Cops are human to and in the heat of the moment things dont always go perfect.....
That is not a excuse for bad policing, just the simple reality of the situation that will eventually occur.
Getting involved in a situation as a cop, or a citizen has serious consequences that "there is not turning back from"
Whitedust I respect your views about the issue but your views are very different than mine.
Even as a Law Enforcement Officer with 19 years on the job I strongly support a citizens right to carry.
For me I could not imagine a more helpless feeling to than hiding under the table at Denny's when some Jacka#$ decides to rob the joint. Sure even though its just a simple robbery and so long as he doesn't start shooting at the clerk or anybody else I would never get involved in a gun fight in a scenario like that but just imagining the sheer feeling of helplessness as you sit there cowering, huddled under the table praying that he doesn't hurt you???? That scenario isnt for me.... For somebody else who isnt confident about the responsibilities of concealed carry it may be.
For me Its about managing the "what if's". What if I am at a shopping mall, resturant, school event, broke down along side the roadway, ect., ect.
And you are correct in your assessment of George Zimmerman. There was a goof that went looking for a conflict. I would argue though that there are very few (in fact I am suprised by the lack of citizen concealed carry shoots) since the vast majoritity of the US has implemented concealed carry. I think that is a testament to the majority of americans being responsible gun owners.
I will say that as a police officer, since concealled carry laws went into effect I have always worried about arriving at a "hot" shooting scene in a public setting where a citizen is engaged in taking action. There is no time to determine who the bad guy is as a Police Officer when you arrive. Person(s) with a gun upon arrival have a very real chance of taking gunfire from a police officer. It is your duty as a police officer to determine who the bad guy is and not simply "spray" Bullets at everybody and all police officers would do diligence to do so but I still believe its just a matter of time until, unfortunatly, there is a tragedy where a good samaritian is shot by a well intentioned cop. Its gonna happen mark my words. Cops are human to and in the heat of the moment things dont always go perfect.....
That is not a excuse for bad policing, just the simple reality of the situation that will eventually occur.
Getting involved in a situation as a cop, or a citizen has serious consequences that "there is not turning back from"
Jerkbait how many times have you discharged your side arm while on patrol? Probably never. Sounds to me like you watch too much silver screen. What moron would hold up a Denny's? Whole lot of cash there... NOT.lol I respect your opinion as an LEO but but now you have to assume everyone is hot & the rest of us have to bear that complication even for a simple traffic stop. I will not carry as I have no desire to shoot anyone & since I'm not armed I will pursue peaceful methods to disfuse a bad situation.
Key word being "moron". If you ever worked in public service, or lived in the city, you would never be surprised by the things that morons are capable of.
Just because one carries does not mean one has a desire to shoot someone. Quite to the contrary, everybody I know who carries hope they NEVER have to use their weapon. I know I sure don't, even if it's justified. That's a burden I'd just prefer not to carry -- but if it's a case of him or me, or my family, well.....I'm not going down without a fight.
Everybody has their preferences.....if you prefer reasoning and diplomacy, that's certainly your right. I hope you're never in a situation where you have to use it but if you are, I hope it works for you.
jerkbait_1075
New member
Whitedust. As for myself I have never pulled the trigger thankfully because I know guys that have and it changes your life forever. In my 19 years two members of my department have. One officer on 2 occasions and another on one occasion. While none of these instances ended in the bad guy losing their life to be so niave that these threats are not out there is unbelievable. I dont even work in a large metropolitan area like a Chicago, or Milwaukee. The threat is there, everywhere, everyday and to everybody cop or not.....
And to believe that someone wouldn't rob something like a Denny's is insane. My department has had Residential Burglaries and Home Invasion for cash money or property items that would total $50 bucks.....
I am not asking you to share my beliefs. These are the realities of the world that MOST of us face......
And to believe that someone wouldn't rob something like a Denny's is insane. My department has had Residential Burglaries and Home Invasion for cash money or property items that would total $50 bucks.....
I am not asking you to share my beliefs. These are the realities of the world that MOST of us face......
The bank where my wife makes daily deposits has been robbed twice in the past 4 months, once within 5 minutes of her being there, big city no, but thieves were from the big city 80 miles away. Nobody wants to shoot somebody its about being prepared and not being a victim. Thats all I'm gonna say because we are getting off the subject.
I wouldnt depend on a .22 for self defense. Not because of a caliber, but because its rimfire. Its just not as dependable of an ignition system as centerfire. Especially when carried daily. I think .32 and even .25acp are fine little self defense rounds. I have a beretta puma in .32acp that is an absolute tack driver out to 25 yards. Its compact and has very little recoil. Everyone has their own opinion on the amount of firepower they need. I feel theres no "right" answer. But there sure is an option for everyone.
As far as for and against CCW, I at least want the right to do so. Even if I dont exercise that right. I would have no problem with stricter regs on getting the permit. The class I took left me more unsure of carrying then I was before I took it. There are alot of legal issues to be aware of that many people who do carry dont fully understand. I dont carry on a daily basis but when I travel I am more apt to. My daily routine doesnt really put me in harms way. But when away from home I can apreciate the added safety.
As far as for and against CCW, I at least want the right to do so. Even if I dont exercise that right. I would have no problem with stricter regs on getting the permit. The class I took left me more unsure of carrying then I was before I took it. There are alot of legal issues to be aware of that many people who do carry dont fully understand. I dont carry on a daily basis but when I travel I am more apt to. My daily routine doesnt really put me in harms way. But when away from home I can apreciate the added safety.
EXCESSIVE FORCE
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jerkbait_1075
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"back on topic"
X's 3.....
I need to learn to think it and not to type it cause I always seem to get knee deep into some sort of debate on this board?????
X's 3.....
I need to learn to think it and not to type it cause I always seem to get knee deep into some sort of debate on this board?????
polarisxcsp
New member
I have a Ruger SR9C and I love it, no complaints at all. Came with a 10 rd and 17 rd mag.
WOW! I gotta say that I expected to get some responses but this is sure a hot topic. Though not as hot as concealed carry in general. I figured I would get differing opinions and some "Off Topic Ramblings" but that what it's called right?!
I'm not 100% sure that I will carry when/if IL passes it, but I will get the permit so I can make that decision for myself when the time comes.
Thanks for all of your comments, recommendations, and reviews. It all helps.
Kurt
I'm not 100% sure that I will carry when/if IL passes it, but I will get the permit so I can make that decision for myself when the time comes.
Thanks for all of your comments, recommendations, and reviews. It all helps.
Kurt
Kurt, IMHO that's smart thinking. Look at it as an insurance policy (the permit, not the firearm itself); if you never have to use it or choose not to use it, that's great -- but it's nice to know it's there if you want to use it.
Also...you have my apologies for clogging up your post with my off-subject debates.
I too question the rimfire vs. centerfire reliability. Which .22 round do you mean Moose? LR, Magnum etc. grain and / or fps.
If .22 cal is acceptable North American Arms has some nifty pocket rockets.
http://northamericanarms.com/firearms.html
Google search of images also shows nice holster / north american arms folder combos for a tiny pocket piece.
If .22 cal is acceptable North American Arms has some nifty pocket rockets.
http://northamericanarms.com/firearms.html
Google search of images also shows nice holster / north american arms folder combos for a tiny pocket piece.
Off topic ramblings is just that & discussions about conceal & carry not far off this topic. For me I don't want to conceal & carry too much responsiblity to have a side arm hot good to go. Yes bad things happen but I don't want to start throwing lead around just because I can. I assure I'm not insane in any way just because I don't eat at Denny's thinking someone will rob & shoot it up. As a LEO you probably tend to think about the worst sitituation & that is aok with me I understand. I was shot thru both legs in a hunting accident when I was 15 so I know what bullets can do. I rehabed my legs & Doc told me you will have trouble when 65 well 66 now & going strong but I have to live with the damage what is done is done. More people with guns during routine daily living will lead to more gun shot wounds why because at that moment they decided to shoot. If they had not been carrying ala George Zimmerman no one would have been shot. To me more legal guns on the street = more shooting just do the math. Overall I'm fine with the legal choice to carry just not for me.