What Do You Like About Your 4s Sled?

[xsledder]

I got a 660 Yellowstone special in 03 for my wife and it turned me off to 4s to this day.
I must say they have come a long way from that top heavy turd

Should've went with the turbo'd version. I have two of them and boy can they move for their size and weight. They can pull your arms out of their sockets when they hook up. Have to be careful not to ratchet the chain or track when you hit the throttle hard. Yes, it can lift the skies.

 

[whitedust]

Agree Moose but don't know if 2s lovers will rail on you for statements just 2 short years ago I posted that lots more longer track models being released than 121s didn't even say 2s or 4s & I got pounded for being a 4s supporter. Agree times are changing & more & more riders are buying 4s then wonder why they didn't come to the 4s side years ago.lol

 

[garageguy]

getting 18 mpg when I need to and going 100 when I want to on 87 reg.

 

[russholio]

I went 4s mostly for the reliability and longevity (even though I had 10062 trouble-free miles on my 05 600 SDI when I sold it). I maintain mine and my wife's, so I figured maintenance would be easier and faster (and less worries) by going 4s. And we tend to keep our sleds a while. My SDI actually got better mileage (16-20) than my 1200 (seems to be around 15-16 but it's still new at only 1000 miles).

I'm one of those freaks who never minded the 2s smoke. Actually, I kinda like it. But I don't miss it as much as I thought I would. And as much as I liked it when my turnout gear had a nice house fire smell to it (I guess that makes me a double freak but that comes from years on the job) I gotta say that 2s smoke and house fire smoke are nothing alike.

At any rate....don't see myself ever going back to 2s.

 

[ezra]

Should've went with the turbo'd version. I have two of them and boy can they move for their size and weight. They can pull your arms out of their sockets when they hook up. Have to be careful not to ratchet the chain or track when you hit the throttle hard. Yes, it can lift the skies.

they did not make one in 03 for the 660 no big thing it was a top heavy tipsy thing with out enough power to spin the track around corners or to straighten it self up on hills so it was totaled out in less than 2 weeks .was not a weight thing she was driving a 97zrt before the 660 .but like I said they have come a long way. still not built for my style of ridding.god that thing was ugly also with that dark green with big 4 stroke in white and red on the side.
I really wanted to like it obviously or I would not have bought it but I should have waited a few yrs for the turbo

 

[ezra]

2 strokes are nice and light in relation to 4 strokes but skill will off-set 75% of that once you learn the needs of a 4 stroke especially off trail. All sleds are too heavy and they all will get stuck and they will all break your back at that point....so what's the big deal about the extra weight? When they build a 2 stroke that weighs 250 pounds....they will have something but 385 lbs compared to 460 lbs...just doesn't make them bricks on skis...as most seem to think. Add 40 pounds of gear and 185 pounds of flabby rider and the weight difference becomes less and less important...even out in the mountains with deep fluff, 4 strokes are grabbing up long time 2 stroke diehards in favor of huge torq gains and reliability.

yeahhh right keep telling your self that when riding down the trail .
the only place a 4s wins in the mountains is on hero snow when all you are doing is blasting shoots.
I am the first to admit I am not the best rider out in the woods but I can hold my own and I have ridden a few submarines in the back woods and never have I said oh this is great I love it every time I let off how it dives that's great.
I know guys who build custom 4s ultra light high power yammis for a living and yes they ride them but 3x the mi on 2s in the hills. all the skill in the world will never overcome a extra 175 over the ski's

 

[Hoosier]

For anyone who has owned a 4 stroke - what don't you like about them? Does the weight ever become an issue so much you would rather get back on a 2 stroke? Would you go back to one of the newer more efficient 2 strokes?

With gas prices seemingly permanently high, I would assume more and more trail riders are looking into 4 strokes, so it would be good to hear the drawbacks if any from those who actually own and ride them.

 

[russholio]

It's harder to get my fix -- can no longer fire them up and huff the exhaust to get my sleddin' blood pumping. Now I have to rely on the weed whacker and blower.

Other than that....hmmm.....if I can think of something, I'll get back to you.

 

[whitedust]

For anyone who has owned a 4 stroke - what don't you like about them? Does the weight ever become an issue so much you would rather get back on a 2 stroke? Would you go back to one of the newer more efficient 2 strokes?

With gas prices seemingly permanently high, I would assume more and more trail riders are looking into 4 strokes, so it would be good to hear the drawbacks if any from those who actually own and ride them.

On trail difficult to nit pik faults 4s handle good, gas & go sleds want to lake blast for miles pull the triger or triple digits on grades 4s don't care no lean out condition. Powder riding like ezra said is whole different story the 4s engine braking will bring the front end down not good for powder but excellent biting corners on trails. 12-15" of powder 4s will do well with firm base underneath but deeper powder & you will be a submarine. I ride fields, lakes & unplowed FRs everyday but stay on the firm areas when I can no problems at all. I have had 4 major stucks in about 10,000 miles & all 4 were nightmares so to me that is the only downside....don't get stuck!! No desire to go back to 2s at all done with them.

 

[uncle_ed]

Like everybody else that has riden a while, 2 stroke machines were the only way to go until the epa crunch. I was lucky to get many years of service from 2-strokes without a meltdown as I would flip them every 3-5 years until I got bit in 2006 and had a catastrophic failure on one. I jumped on to a 2007 Apex GT and just loved that thing.

The good: It was a well made dependable machine that handled nice once set up to my liking. Good on gas (87 octane) and did not have to worry about adding oil. It had arm stretching torque and sounded throaty and bad***. 3 years and 6000 miles later I had performed nothing but routine maintainence for the most part and sold it with confidence that the new owner was getting a good machine with alot of life still left in it.
The bad: The machine had what I considered excessive back shifting/engine braking to the point where you almost never used the brakes. It went through 2 sets of exhaust donuts in 6000 miles that were a pita to change. Oil changes were a pita. The machine was too heavy up front and with all the weight on the skis it would just spin the track out of the whole with all that torque (even with 192 pics). The machine was heavy for the type of riding I do which is alot of ditchbanging. I know thay are all heavy when stuck but shave a 100+ pounds off a sled and I would rather dig that one out all day long!

It seems Yamaha has addressed many of the issues with that particular sled but I think that weight has not. I am getting close to thinking about a new sled as my 2010 600 etec is closing in on its warranty. I am leaning back towards a 4 stroke but am still on the fence. I like the 900 Ace in the XS chassis as the weight is kept down somewhat on that sled but I would need to ride one first and let it age/mature a bit as well. Curious as to weight on the Viper as well. Time and scavenging through the forums till a test ride will tell!

 

[Banjo Man]

I have an RX-1 and a Vector and love them. Would never go back. The RX has a few handling issues but overall rails on a lake or grade. The Vector is smooth and the powerband is great between 30-60 which most riding is at. Also the quietness of the Vector allows me to listen to an I-pod without blowing out my helmet speakers.

 

[gogebictodd]

I have an 08 Nytro, before owning that I rented new Polaris shifts, or rode friends 2 ups.

A very different ride feel than I was used to, but now that I have put 1400 miles on it, I have grown to like it
alot! Great mileage, realiable (hasnt stranded me yet), most important to me is just gas and go, no fooling
around with oil each ride. Plan to keep it for the long haul, since I only use it a couple of weekends a season.

 

[craze1cars]

Some may find this to be an interesting weight comparo. Had to dig it out of my archives over on Dootalk to remember the numbers, but I found 'em:

When I purchased my 2010 Renegade 1200, I still had my 2008 Switchback 700 Dragon sitting in the garage. Both machines, sitting side-by-side, both showing about 3/8 tank of fuel, both full of oil/coolant and ready to ride. I grabbed 3 old bathroom scales I keep out in my shop and set them under 3 locations and came up with the following:

10 Ski-doo 1200 Renegade Adrenaline: RF spindle 176lbs, LF spindle 165lbs, Rear 222 lbs = 563 lbs total
08 Polaris Switchback 700 Dragon: RF spindle 177lbs, LF spindle 165 lbs, Rear 239 lbs = 581 lbs total

I was so shocked when I saw the numbers I shuffled the scales around and did it twice. Same results give or take 2 lbs.

Confirmed: My brand new 4 stroke, electric start, 1200 actually weighed LESS than my 2 year old 2 stroke, pull-start, batteryless 700 Polaris. Both same track lengths, both in ready-to-ride condition with partial fuel fill.

Did they have exactly the same amount of fuel in each sled? Doubtful. Was this entirely scientific? No. But it still said something to me...anyone on an older chassis 2 stroke, considering switching to a newer chassis 4 stroke? You might actually LOSE weight in the transition...or the difference will be too small to ever notice a difference.

Now...if I compared an 800 Ski-Doo to a 1200 Ski-Doo, obviously the 2 stroke is lighter. But Ezra's comment about "overcoming an extra 175 over the skis" is a gross exaggeration by a factor of at least 5. Doo as an example from their spec sheets:

1200 Gade: 532
900 Ace Gade: 503
ETEC 600 Gade: 481

The weight penalty of a 4 stroke can be as small as 24 lbs...or as much as 51 lbs...depending on your engine choice. It is directly over the skis, and my Doo is more nose-heavy than my Polaris was. Wider aftermarket ski's help compensate for it. But the penalty is certainly not anywhere near 175 lbs...

All that said, if I go mountain riding, I'm renting a 2 stroke. The difference off-trail in TRUE deep powder, and when climbing, is very real.

 

[goofy600]

I'm a 2s guy but I'm interested about the 4s, and I have to laugh at all the people saying just gas and go, because opening I side panel unscrewing a cap and poring in some oil is not that hard, just saying.

 

[Attak man]

That's a great sled with great ride and suspension that shames the Yamaha sleds...but...the spindles were all wrong on that new design sled. While the sled was hard to steer and would improve with a good set of spindles and skis...once you do those things there isn't a better riding, suspensioned sled out there even today. It is as good as it gets.

I don't know about that moose....Shame the yamaha's??? A little biased?? The FST would be my last choice of 4 strokes...they are even heavier than my attack, and you had to turbo those things, to get them to move.
If you haven't ridden a 2011 or newer yamaha...then your view will be tainted...they have improved their suspension calibration alot, and the power steering really works well.
Big difference between my 07 and a 2011 yami 4 stroke.

Two of my good friends rode FST's the last 4 seasons...BOTH traded them in for rush's...both said they were just too heavy, and wore them out on long rides.

I am in the same boat...as much as I like my attak...it's a heavy pig...lots of pluses to the four strokes....BUT....I am leaning towards a lighter two stroke for my next sled...I really don't care that much about fuel economy, or fit and finish...I care more about having fun....and right now on tight wooded trails, the attack wears me out...it's too damn heavy.
Plus...how many of you keep a sled more than 5 years??? I know I don't....every two to three years I am trading for a different sled...so am I really saving money on a 4 stroke???
Cleaning power valves is no big deal...takes less than an hour...ever try to change the oil on a yamaha 4 stroke??
Everybody justify's their sled purchase for their own reasons...for me running an average of 1,200 miles per season and trading every three years...there is no real cost savings running a 4 stroke....unless my two stroke blows up...and yes...I have blown up a few of those in my time (all but one was yellow).

If somebody comes out with a 130 HP Four Stroke, that weighs 460lbs dry...Im on it.
Until then...Im going back to two strokes (don't know which brand yet)...To each their own guys...ride what you like, and have fun.

 

[whitedust]

Attak man you will be back after next 2s burndown DI 2s not your old 488 & you always buy used so whatever 2s you buy will have miles & used up a some of it's life. A used Attak with 10,000 miles just broken in & I know you know this.lol. Better off with a used Nytro & go beat the heck out of it & have best of both worlds. I'm spending more time in the Twistys this year too but I know as soon as typical snirty season in WI I will be back to more riding in the UP & you will too. Viper might be the sled but need to throw a leg over & ride see what I think.

 

[fusion]

I am in the same boat...as much as I like my attak...it's a heavy pig...lots of pluses to the four strokes....BUT....I am leaning towards a lighter two stroke for my next sled...I really don't care that much about fuel economy, or fit and finish...I care more about having fun....and right now on tight wooded trails, the attack wears me out...it's too damn heavy.
Plus...how many of you keep a sled more than 5 years???


If somebody comes out with a 130 HP Four Stroke, that weighs 460lbs dry...Im on it.
Until then...Im going back to two strokes (don't know which brand yet)...To each their own guys...ride what you like, and have fun.

Good post Attak - pretty much exactly where I'm at as well.
Big miles every year, buy a 4-stroke, if not, can't lose all that much on a 2S.

 

[tundra ron]

I see Mr Freeze sled on the board with 25000 miles Nick Keller sled with over 60000 on. No brainer what sleds are the best value and longest lasting.

 

[marksinnc]

Not to start a brand bashing contest as i am not a Yamaha fan, but two weeks ago, I followed a blue Yamaha, either an RX-1 or Apex (two pipes out the back of the seat) on the trail for about 10-miles. He had Amsoil stickers all over it, so i assume that is what he was runninging in it. This sled smelled so bad my eyes were watering from the fumes and it left a very bad taste in my mouth. For you guys talking about not smelling like two-stroke, was there something wrong with this guys sled, or what? The sled looked nice and well taken care of, but damn did it smell vile.

 

[agriffinjd]

I have a 2011 Yamaha FX Nytro XTX (the 144"x1.25" track).

Favorite thing: Torque. Arm-stretching, ski-lifting, torque. Not sure if it's unique to the Nytro's motor, but I love it. Only other 4 stroke I've ridden is the rs rage 973cc carbed which didn't have the torque of Nytro 1049cc FI.

Very very close 2nd favorite thing: Engine longevity. I'm only at like 4300 miles, but it's nice to worry less about how long the engine will last.

Nice things:

lack of 2-stroke smell, which I used to like while riding but didn't like after it aged in the closet on the jacket.

Not having to add oil is nice, but not that big of a deal as others have pointed out. Not too much work to pour a little oil in.

What I don't like: weight of the sled when stuck. It just sucks. However, it does okay while boondocking or breaking powder, but when stuck. Ugh.