Vacine Shot

dfattack

Well-known member
In all actuality, the "correct count" is really irrelevant. 560,000 deaths vs lets say 300,000. Really? My question is, how many deaths does it take before we will react to not only preserving our own health & welfare much less that, all those around us, not to mention immediate family? Despite the so called accuracy of the death count, we should all be diligent in preserving life as we knew it. This has me wondering where our alliances are when it comes to an issue of global concern much less our very own. We support our local business, friends, neighbors, & fellow snowmobilers in times of crisis. I hate to say it, but this pandemic situation is no different. We need to be diligent for all of our sake, because without the aforementioned, we would have nobody to support for any reason, nobody. Peace out. -Mezz

Not really sure what you mean.

I think you are saying the death count doesn't matter...meaning even if the number was 100 we had to do something. I agree, but what I was suggesting is that there is always going to be deaths be it natural, due to flue, cancer, car crashes etc. We also apparently have covid type viruses all the time which I didn't know. Once you filter out the deaths that would have occurred anyway, I believe the deaths from covid was significantly less that the overblown (my opinion) half million death count. With that said, with such a small chance of dying from covid why take the shot if you are not a high risk individual? Again, my opinion and hope I understood you correctly. If not, my apologies
 

russholio

Well-known member
In all actuality, the "correct count" is really irrelevant. 560,000 deaths vs lets say 300,000. Really? My question is, how many deaths does it take before we will react to not only preserving our own health & welfare much less that, all those around us, not to mention immediate family? Despite the so called accuracy of the death count, we should all be diligent in preserving life as we knew it. This has me wondering where our alliances are when it comes to an issue of global concern much less our very own. We support our local business, friends, neighbors, & fellow snowmobilers in times of crisis. I hate to say it, but this pandemic situation is no different. We need to be diligent for all of our sake, because without the aforementioned, we would have nobody to support for any reason, nobody. Peace out. -Mezz

Are we all willing to wear face diapers and practice social distancing to "save" us from every airborne pathogen out there, from here on out? Discovered, and yet to be disovered? Because if we're not (and count me among the not), then doing it just for covid is hypocritical.
 

dfattack

Well-known member
Please explain the "coded" comment to me. Are you seriously suggesting that there is a "covid" box that a hospital checks to get paid a bounty?

Oh yes. not limited to hospitals...Doctors too. I know this for a fact. it's either $8,000 or $10,000 per doctor
 

dfattack

Well-known member
My perfectly healthy great aunt finished getting her 2nd dose of the vaccine within the past week or 2 and is currently hospitalized after fainting and passing out a couple days ago. Doctors won’t give us squat for information on what is wrong. She is truly confused as to what happened because she was one of the healthiest ~80 year olds you’d ever meet. She was moved to a rehab center and there’s a chance she may not make it through, saddest part is due to covid protocols she has to “quarantine” there for 14 days before anyone can visit her and like I said there’s a chance she may not make it... Not my only vaccine story for the week either... Girfriends coworker has a 78 year old neighbor who most would think she is 55. Apparently the coworker even goes on runs with this 78 year old, she’s that healthy. She got her 2nd dose I believe she said Monday or Tuesday and passed away yesterday due to an infection from the vaccine, she’s from the Neenah area. Won’t hear it on the news though and it’s so unfortunate the countries entire narrative has switched to push this vaccine down our throats. These 2 events have sealed the deal for me, and I will NOT become someone’s guinea pig. We’ve been dealing with this scamdemic for a year now and if you made it this long without “getting covid” chances are you have the antibodies in your system already and should be getting tested to see if you do indeed have them before even THINKING about jumping in line for this unproven vaccine... Sorry if my comments come off as harsh but I don’t know how to word how I feel about this at the moment in any other way... Know what’s even worse than hearing this news? The fact that I don’t even personally know a single person who has died from or even was hospitalized with any symptoms worse than a common cold because of “covid” in the past year.

Thank you for sharing Indy and sorry to hear what you are going through. It's real life stories like this that people need to hear so they can make their own decisions and not be forced to take it. Previous vaccines took years of tests on lab rats and human trials before asking society to take a vaccine. This whole process is premature. I'm OK with incentivizing the pharmaceutical companies to find a vaccine just not forcing anyone to take. We aren't there yet but seems like we will end up there.
 

dfattack

Well-known member
Are we all willing to wear face diapers and practice social distancing to "save" us from every airborne pathogen out there, from here on out? Discovered, and yet to be disovered? Because if we're not (and count me among the not), then doing it just for covid is hypocritical.

Oh so true
 

dcsnomo

Moderator
Hey old buddy! I’m doing great and I hope you be are also. I’m not 100% sure I understand what your saying, here’s why. The 99.7% figure is for those who become infected. It’s not a percentage of who may become infected. So what the CDC is saying is that if anyone under 70 gets COVID-19, they have a 99.7% chance of surviving. In this case, behavior is irrelevant because the focus of the referenced percentage is based on health, not the risk of catching the virus. Hope this helps buddy! Are you still over in Door county?

Yeah, still in Door County, kinda! Sold the motel 4 yrs ago, so I spend a couple months a year in San Diego. Life is good, health is good, about all an old guy could wish for!
 

dcsnomo

Moderator
Are we all willing to wear face diapers and practice social distancing to "save" us from every airborne pathogen out there, from here on out? Discovered, and yet to be disovered? Because if we're not (and count me among the not), then doing it just for covid is hypocritical.

Maybe we will. It's a big world out there and they don't all act like us. In Japan people wear masks in crowded situations regularly. Maybe riding a crowded subway in NY with a cold and no mask is wrong. Maybe going to the gym when you have a cold is wrong. Maybe, just maybe some of our behaviors need to change. Not all the world is Michigan fresh air and a solo ride in an F150 to get to work.

I'm living in a metro area of 3.3 million people, and yeah, if you have a cold please put on a mask before getting on the trolley.
 

dcsnomo

Moderator
Oh yes. not limited to hospitals...Doctors too. I know this for a fact. it's either $8,000 or $10,000 per doctor

Still doesn't answer my question. The poster said hospitals get paid more for the same treatment if they claim covid. In other words, a heart attack patient on a ventilator becomes more profitable if he morphs into a covid patient given the same treatment. I don't believe it.
 

dcsnomo

Moderator
Getting the vaccine certainly is a personal choice. I got it because I am 68 years old and I travel, mostly to cities. Also, life expectancy is 77 years so I've only got 9 years to "bonus time". If the vaccine causes my johnson to fall off in 10 years oh well. If I was early 30s, with a relatively patterned life amongst the same people, same places, and 50 years ahead of me I would wait it out.

Some of you are posting about not knowing anyone who got covid, or got seriously ill. Let me give you the old guy experience. About 25 people I know have had it, three seriously ill, one recovered fully, one on long term oxygen, one dead.

I don't want to catch this in the last decade or so of my life, I worked 50 years to get here and I'm gonna sprint to the finish line in my own style.
 

euphoric1

Well-known member
Are we all willing to wear face diapers and practice social distancing to "save" us from every airborne pathogen out there, from here on out? Discovered, and yet to be disovered? Because if we're not (and count me among the not), then doing it just for covid is hypocritical.

EXACTLY!!! but wait!!! it completely eradicated the flu that on average has killed half a million people world wide each year!!!! YEAH RIGHT!!!
 
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lenny

Guest
Getting the vaccine certainly is a personal choice. I got it because I am 68 years old and I travel, mostly to cities. Also, life expectancy is 77 years so I've only got 9 years to "bonus time". If the vaccine causes my johnson to fall off in 10 years oh well. If I was early 30s, with a relatively patterned life amongst the same people, same places, and 50 years ahead of me I would wait it out.



Some of you are posting about not knowing anyone who got covid, or got seriously ill. Let me give you the old guy experience. About 25 people I know have had it, three seriously ill, one recovered fully, one on long term oxygen, one dead.



I don't want to catch this in the last decade or so of my life, I worked 50 years to get here and I'm gonna sprint to the finish line in my own style.

You make a very important point. This is precisely why we need a comprehensive approach to these types of crisis. What you illustrate is the need for older folk, anybody who has a higher risk of damage or death to take the precautions WITH HELP IF NEEDED in order to come out of this with the least amount of negative effects of all this. What we have done is subjected the entire country to something that a smaller segment only needed to be concerned about. With that said, we created unnecessary collateral damage that proved to be in ineffective. How could any governor of any state think that you could put the most vulnerable people in an environment with a high risk? Do you see the problem there? This is not a one size fits all situation. So what I observe happening is not just simple mistakes, I think they are rather deliberate and exhibiting the effects and desires of a transformation of our current political/governmental system.
 

dfattack

Well-known member
Still doesn't answer my question. The poster said hospitals get paid more for the same treatment if they claim covid. In other words, a heart attack patient on a ventilator becomes more profitable if he morphs into a covid patient given the same treatment. I don't believe it.

I have heard nurses call into radio talk shows that have confirmed this and it's actually worse. One nurse in particular was upset about what was going on in the hospital she works at. One person in a particular wing tested positive so the staff was directed to count the entire wing (patients) as if infected since they were assumed to eventually test positive due to proximity of a positive test. That is one of the reason positive test results continued to soar and yes the hospitals (and doctors) get money when this happens.

Another thing, my office manager's friend wasn't feeling well last year. She didn't want to go to the hospital since this was all new so she called her old (retired) doctor at home. She told him how she felt and he said she should go to the hospital. So she did. When she checked in the Hospital asked what doctor sent her in and the lady told the staff her ex doctor who's retired told her to. She was asked for the doctor's name anyway. Within a week or so the retired doctor received a check for either $8,000 or $10,000. Yes it happened that fast. unbelievable...
 

old abe

Well-known member
Whoa, radio talk shows now? Radio talk shows are a real source of Fantasy Land BS. It's way over the top now, eh!
 

Cirrus

Member
Thank you for sharing Indy and sorry to hear what you are going through. It's real life stories like this that people need to hear so they can make their own decisions and not be forced to take it. Previous vaccines took years of tests on lab rats and human trials before asking society to take a vaccine. This whole process is premature. I'm OK with incentivizing the pharmaceutical companies to find a vaccine just not forcing anyone to take. We aren't there yet but seems like we will end up there.

>Quote Originally Posted by indy_500 View Post
My perfectly healthy great aunt finished getting her 2nd dose of the vaccine within the past week or 2 and is currently hospitalized after fainting and passing out a couple days ago. Doctors won’t give us squat for information on what is wrong. She is truly confused as to what happened because she was one of the healthiest ~80 year olds you’d ever meet. She was moved to a rehab center and there’s a chance she may not make it through, saddest part is due to covid protocols she has to “quarantine” there for 14 days before anyone can visit her and like I said there’s a chance she may not make it... Not my only vaccine story for the week either... Girfriends coworker has a 78 year old neighbor who most would think she is 55. Apparently the coworker even goes on runs with this 78 year old, she’s that healthy. She got her 2nd dose I believe she said Monday or Tuesday and passed away yesterday due to an infection from the vaccine, she’s from the Neenah area. Won’t hear it on the news though and it’s so unfortunate the countries entire narrative has switched to push this vaccine down our throats. These 2 events have sealed the deal for me, and I will NOT become someone’s guinea pig. We’ve been dealing with this scamdemic for a year now and if you made it this long without “getting covid” chances are you have the antibodies in your system already and should be getting tested to see if you do indeed have them before even THINKING about jumping in line for this unproven vaccine... Sorry if my comments come off as harsh but I don’t know how to word how I feel about this at the moment in any other way... Know what’s even worse than hearing this news? The fact that I don’t even personally know a single person who has died from or even was hospitalized with any symptoms worse than a common cold because of “covid” in the past year.<



Won't see me getting any vaccine either....they can "practice their brand of medicine" on all you other brave ones, until they get it all perfected. At that point, I'll be in. I've been healthy thru this whole ordeal, and I'm not taking any chances on experimental vaccines, I've heard way too many stories like Indy's above.
 

dcsnomo

Moderator
Well why else would they put the code on the person? Just for the CDC to count? Someone else said it above: follow the money. Why would they create a “Covid” bill to help people if there is no way to collect money?? You find that hard to believe?? Where have you been the last 12 months?? Hospitals were and still are getting $$ for each Covid case.

You are not following my point. I know hospitals get paid to treat covid. Hospitals get paid for services provided. One day in an ICU bed is the same rate for a heart attack, a car accident, or a covid case. Yes, covid treatment may involve a lot more services, hence a higher bill. But I disagree that the RATE charged for a service for a covid patient is a higher RATE than any other patient for the same service. Yes the total might be higher at the end due to more treatment, but I doubt that there is a premium charged due to illness type.

Let's stop this part of the discussion, Ok? Getting nowhere.
 

russholio

Well-known member
Maybe we will. It's a big world out there and they don't all act like us. In Japan people wear masks in crowded situations regularly. Maybe riding a crowded subway in NY with a cold and no mask is wrong. Maybe going to the gym when you have a cold is wrong. Maybe, just maybe some of our behaviors need to change. Not all the world is Michigan fresh air and a solo ride in an F150 to get to work.

I'm living in a metro area of 3.3 million people, and yeah, if you have a cold please put on a mask before getting on the trolley.

Good for you. Don't look down on me because I won't.
 
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lenny

Guest
I don’t think we want to get into the efficacy of masks,,,,,

if we did, I think many of us would be severely disappointed or even disturbed over it. I’ve been studying this since the third week in March,,,, a year ago. Just search this out on the web and see what you come up with, it’s not what you’re going to think. Random clinical trials are the ones that you want to take a look at because they are non bias.

here’s just a cut and paste from the results in the conclusion on cloth masks back in 2015.

Results The rates of all infection outcomes were highest in the cloth mask arm, with the rate of ILI statistically significantly higher in the cloth mask arm (relative risk (RR)=13.00, 95% CI 1.69 to 100.07) compared with the medical mask arm. Cloth masks also had significantly higher rates of ILI compared with the control arm. An analysis by mask use showed ILI (RR=6.64, 95% CI 1.45 to 28.65) and laboratory-confirmed virus (RR=1.72, 95% CI 1.01 to 2.94) were significantly higher in the cloth masks group compared with the medical masks group. Penetration of cloth masks by particles was almost 97% and medical masks 44%.

Conclusions This study is the first RCT of cloth masks, and the results caution against the use of cloth masks. This is an important finding to inform occupational health and safety. Moisture retention, reuse of cloth masks and poor filtration may result in increased risk of infection. Further research is needed to inform the widespread use of cloth masks globally. However, as a precautionary measure, cloth masks should not be recommended for HCWs, particularly in high-risk situations, and guidelines need to be updated.

—————————————

Since this article was written, there has been an update in reference to cover 19 and here’s what they say;



  • Published on: 30 March 2020
    COVID-19, shortages of masks and the use of cloth masks as a last resort
    • Chandini R MacIntyre[/URL], Academic physician The Kirby Institute, University of New South Wales
    • Other Contributors:
      • Chi Dung Tham, Academic physician
      • Holly Seale, Academic
      • Abrar Chughtai, Academic physician


    Critical shortages of personal protective equipment (PPE) have resulted in the US Centers for Disease Control downgrading their recommendations for health workers treating COVID-19 patients from respirators to surgical masks and finally to home-made cloth masks. As authors of the only published randomised controlled clinical trial of cloth masks, we have been getting daily emails about this from health workers concerned about using cloth masks. The study found that cloth mask wearers had higher rates of infection than even the standard practice control group of health workers, and the filtration provided by cloth masks was poor compared to surgical masks. At the time of the study, there had been very little work done in this space, and so little thought into how to improve the protective value of the cloth masks. Until now, most guidelines on PPE did not even mention cloth masks, despite many health workers in Asia using them.
    Health workers are asking us if they should wear no mask at all if cloth masks are the only option. Our research does not condone health workers working unprotected. We recommend that health workers should not work during the COVID-19 pandemic without respiratory protection as a matter of work health and safety. In addition, if health workers get infected, high rates of staff absenteeism from illness may also affect health system capacity to respond. Some health workers may still choose to work in inadequate PPE. In this case, the physic...
    ——————-

    Now we have the majority of the United States population wearing cloth masks which are highly infected with contamination. Originally Dr. Fauci said that there are unintended consequences from wearing masks and this is precisely what he accidentally told the truth about, and then later tried to cover up for his fault.




 
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