snobuilder
Well-known member
The same force that wants you to move to an EV also wants to shut down power plants.
Electric vehicle
- Thread starter katden4
- Start date
That’s why hydrogen cell has to emerge sometime. Just seems logical to me why waste time with home charging that never will be successful in mass or have enough batteries to go around indefinitely. I don’t get it.
ddhanna
Active member
I think it is because hydrogen requires nearly as much energy to produce as it delivers. They have been working on it for a long time. It needs a scientific breakthrough.
eagle1
Well-known member
Main Street Calumet, Inc on Instagram: "This is the first electric car charger in Calumet (at least that we’re aware of)! It’s a Rivian charger, it’s open to the public and is located in the parking lot behind 326/330 5th Street in downtown Calumet!"
159 likes, 6 comments - mainstcalumet on August 6, 2022: "This is the first electric car charger in Calumet (at least that we’re aware of)! It’s a Rivi..."
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I can’t believe solar , wind and conventional electric power plants can handle all the demands of electricity that the greenies want to achieve. Fossil fuel power not part of the plan does little to achieve zero emissions. Something has to give to get alternative fuels to the market place and Hydrogen is a good bet. The UK already scheduled to convert 3 million plus homes to hydrogen heat. I’m assuming electric generation will be tapped out so the world will have to turn to another fuel eventually other than fossil fuel. Hydrogen good for electric vehicles , home heat virtually endless supply no carbon footprint. Lithium batteries have limits of life and recycling and hydrogen can help those batteries to be smaller and more available. Hydrogen has its place and technology will advance as EVs advance. Hydrogen makes too much sense to ignore and not pursue. The electric supply will be saturated very soon considering technology available to create it wave ,wind and solar , no nukes, no fossil what’s left only known now is hydrogen. One of the most heard objections on this thread of EVs is range and quick refueling time hydrogen is a solution for both those issues. In time hydrogen will have its place just needs infrastructure which the Brits are pursuing now. Governments will get behind hydrogen just not ready to mandate it yet but totally supports electric anything.
dfattack
Well-known member
I can't help but think that the number is now more fluid than any time in history. Kinda depends on how you feel today...am I male or am I female???
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Guest
I believe Mother Nature still only recognizes gender as born. And Mother Nature always wins. But you do have a point.I can't help but think that the number is now more fluid than any time in history. Kinda depends on how you feel today...am I male or am I female???
goofy600
Well-known member
This is very true my son is an electrical engineer and works for a utility in Wisconsin and said this year (not even a real hot one) that the Midwest almost came to a point of not having enough supply to support the demand. So I asked why are they tearing down plants? And his comment is most of the time they can meet demand so why run plants for just the peak times. So until they get more green generation it is only going to get worse with more demand on the system. I also worked in the electrical industry on the power distribution side and can tell you that there are places that have been upgraded to handle more load but there are still more that can’t and that is in the rural areas. Companies spend money where they can make money and don’t where they aren’t, until they have to.
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With a hydrogen fuel cell you first have to convert the electricity to hydrogen via electrolysis, which is only about 75% efficient. Then the gas has to be compressed, chilled and transported, which loses another 10%. The fuel cell process of converting hydrogen back to electricity is only 60% efficient, after which you have the same 5% loss from driving the vehicle motor as for a Battery Powered Electric vehicle. The grand total is a 62% loss – much less efficient than Battery Powered Electrics.
Manufacturing hydrogen is not without issues, I believe a few hydrogen production facilities have had some explosions in recent years.. one in Santa Clara and another in Norway. Where does this energy come from to make hydrogen?
Also, fuel cells have a byproduct of water... this could be problematic on cold winter days in the Northland.....
There are many types of hydrogen fuel white ,green and gray. Scientists are just finding hydrogen naturally occurring in the earths crust that they didn’t know was available until we started testing for it’s presence. Simply drill and capture it in a well. Hydrogen can also be mixed with natural gas as a fuel so very flexible in fuel applications. It is interesting we have known about hydrogen for such a long time and only seriously started to consider it a green renewable fuel. I would not be concerned about hydrogen storage blowing up its very rare probably more rare than oil refinery blow ups. As far as water exhaust it’s water vapor not a stream of liquid water out an exhaust pipe so no icing on northern roads. Imo hydrogen will be used and will be scaled up as an alternate fuel to electricity and to produce electricity. For sure hydrogen is in its beginnings but has endless possibilities especially as the electrical grid is maxed out.
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I would personally not rule out hydrogen. I would not even rule out natural gas. It would be quicker to build nat gas electrical generation plants than just about any other alternative. But the greenies absolutely don't want any part of that.
If you just follow the money world wide the investment in electric is huge. Also the governments world wide are providing tax breaks and rebates - whatever it takes. It is not just a USA thing. So - yes - it is being as shoved down our collective throats.
You can deal we with that in three ways. You can buck it completely and have nothing to do with it. Or you can jump in with both feet and rush out and try to get your hands on one. Or you can sit back and think about it and see how things shake out. That looks to be the way most on this site are sitting. Which is fine.
I have become a proponent of electrics after about five years of reading everything I could find about them. The single biggest factor that cannot be overlooked is the incredible investment in electrics. In my own head this money was not spent with the thought that it wasn't going to work It is coming because the car makers and the governments want it. Maybe not in that order.
If you just follow the money world wide the investment in electric is huge. Also the governments world wide are providing tax breaks and rebates - whatever it takes. It is not just a USA thing. So - yes - it is being as shoved down our collective throats.
You can deal we with that in three ways. You can buck it completely and have nothing to do with it. Or you can jump in with both feet and rush out and try to get your hands on one. Or you can sit back and think about it and see how things shake out. That looks to be the way most on this site are sitting. Which is fine.
I have become a proponent of electrics after about five years of reading everything I could find about them. The single biggest factor that cannot be overlooked is the incredible investment in electrics. In my own head this money was not spent with the thought that it wasn't going to work It is coming because the car makers and the governments want it. Maybe not in that order.
eagle1
Well-known member
As said before orderly transition over time is necessary to gradually move to EVs. I’m convinced the grid is unable to handle worldwide saturation of EVs if electric moves too fast. The grid could handle it if the greenies would transition to universal green energy in an orderly fashion and hydrogen has its place to replace oil. Unfortunately the dems / liberals see their power fading so jamming EVs down our throats and causing extreme pain to our economy that will just get worse. November elections can’t come fast enough and probably Spring before a new Congress and Senate can return sanity to our government.
ddhanna
Active member
Citing “significant material cost increases and other factors,” Ford increased the prices of the F-150 Lighting across the various trim levels on offer.
For instance, the base model, known as the Lightning Pro, which once started at $39,974 has now seen its price rise $7,000 to $46,974. The XLT High Extended Range and Lariat Extended Range trims saw the highest price hikes of $8,500, with each now costing $80,974 and $85,974 respectively. The Platinum Extended range saw the smallest price hike of $6,000, though it now retails for $96,874.
So much for Brandon's EV incentive.
For instance, the base model, known as the Lightning Pro, which once started at $39,974 has now seen its price rise $7,000 to $46,974. The XLT High Extended Range and Lariat Extended Range trims saw the highest price hikes of $8,500, with each now costing $80,974 and $85,974 respectively. The Platinum Extended range saw the smallest price hike of $6,000, though it now retails for $96,874.
So much for Brandon's EV incentive.
pclark
Well-known member
Highly subsidized for years I might add.
heckler56
Active member
Let’s not forget that for decades our energy secretaries at the federal level were former ADM exec’s.