Union thugs are at it again

[indy_500]

x3 If you take away pay AND benefits, they will all go in search of other jobs, they'll find some guy off the street to replace them, and all the kids education goes down the tubes. Are there bad teachers out there? Yes, their are plenty. I'd say 25% of the teachers at my school don't deserve to be paid what they do. But if you don't pay the good teachers any money, there won't be any good teachers left!

 

[russholio]

Trade unions arent like public unions Teachers,Police ,and Fire ect we in the trades are not protected from losing our jobs at any point .You cannot stereo type all unions as being bad my .02 UNION YES

I happen to be in an FD union. I can't speak for every one everywhere, but I know ours can't protect your job when you do something stupid -- nor should they. Ask my two coworkers who lost their jobs, one five years ago and one just a couple weeks ago.

The guys on our executive board get paid a couple hundred bucks a year -- it's not a job for them, they're not sitting in some high-rise office building, and it's nowhere near enough to cover the time, energy and gas and everything else they use in their efforts.

Anybody who thinks that a city is above using underhanded tactics is sadly mistaken. Ours is notorious for mismanaging money and then crying that their employees cost too much. Example: several years ago they purchased a church and several area houses with the intent of tearing them all down and building a new city hall. Great plan, except they neglected to ask the voters -- who voted it down AFTER the city blew all the money on it. So they sold it all and took a huge loss. Bet they wish they had that money (well over $1M) now. Of course, who do they come to with their hat in their hand when funds are low? And, incidentally, our union has helped them out far more than we've turned them down. Another example: the city recently tacked on a $6 per month charge on the water bill -- with no vote of the people, because that's one area they can tack on a fee and no vote is required -- and they call it an "emergency services fee". Yet, not one cent of this fee goes to the police, or fire departments. But few citizens know that, so naturally they're cheesed off at the FD and PD because they think they're paying more to keep us. Pretty slick how they managed to shift the blame from them over to us. And now, they want to pass a millage to raise money, and of course they want our help (which I'm sure we'll do, since we all want jobs). We're the greatest guys ever, when they want/need our help. Otherwise, we're scoundrels.

Point is, there are abuses on both sides of the aisle in the labor relations arena. So I would concur most wholeheartedly with the last sentence of the quote above.

 

[harvest1121]

If 25% of the teachers are bad why are they not gone? (UNIONS) You can always say what you make in salary but what do your benefits cost and how much do they contribute to your pension? So for the summer months do you work? It might not be the new teachers that are making the higher wages but the old dinosaurs are going to make almost as much till they die and thats killing the system. I am not saying teachers have an easy job. But it sound like you know the education system is broken and needs to be fixed.

 

[ezra]

but part of the point is is that cities do f up money and why not it is not there money. the politician knows he wants your vote and that most of his non city worker constituents dont pay attention to facts just what they are told buy the politician.the politician would rather keep the city workers fat and happy than face the bad press crated buy the union for the children sound familiar?example Madison dose not matter that the contracts are 100% unsustainable and if they dont act now there will be no money to honer past contracts let alone continue to pay current workers. ask your self what corp in the USA that had government style golden pension programs have not filed bankruptcy and restructured its future retirement contribution program NON. they have all restructured now it is the governments turn UNSUSTANABLE!so when it comes to negotiating with the union no one has anything to loose except the tax payer and he has been asleep at the wheel.
city is not playing with there money and the city worker union knows it wont be replaced with a lower bid contract so ask for the farm and get it.
so who is looking out for me the tax payer in these negotiations

 

[ezra]

and Indy as soon as you put in at least 3 yrs min working and start actually paying the government a % of what you have earned some may start to respect your input on a subject that you currently have 0 personal experience with.after you join your union and start busting your hump with no more recognition or pay than the lump you are covering for is receiving let us know how you feel on the subject

 

[rocketman356]

but part of the point is is that cities do f up money and why not it is not there money. the politician knows he wants your vote and that most of his non city worker constituents dont pay attention to facts just what they are told buy the politician.the politician would rather keep the city workers fat and happy than face the bad press crated buy the union for the children sound familiar?example Madison dose not matter that the contracts are 100% unsustainable and if they dont act now there will be no money to honer past contracts let alone continue to pay current workers. ask your self what corp in the USA that had government style golden pension programs have not filed bankruptcy and restructured its future retirement contribution program NON. they have all restructured now it is the governments turn UNSUSTANABLE!so when it comes to negotiating with the union no one has anything to loose except the tax payer and he has been asleep at the wheel.
city is not playing with there money and the city worker union knows it wont be replaced with a lower bid contract so ask for the farm and get it.
so who is looking out for me the tax payer in these negotiations

EZRA FOR PREZ.....sock it 2 em

 

[xsledder]

I will not change my opinion. I'm just sick of republicans making 100k a year, complaining about the economy and blaiming unions and the union workers who make half as much as them. What do they have to complain about anyways? That it costs them too much for fuel to go boating, atving, and snowmobiling? And it cost too much for them to fill up their big ole F-350?

I will shut my mouth before I get in trouble

I thought you where going to shut your month before you got in trouble, or, do you feel so intelligent that you most correct us "know-it-alls".

I see you have class envy before you grew out of your punk stage. You keep going this way and you will make life miserable for only one person, YOURSELF.

I own a company therefore I must be one of those greedy, republican, keeping you down, looking at the bottom line only bosses. Maybe, maybe not, but I really don't care what you think.

Trust me, if I caught wind of your attitude in a job interview I wouldn't hire you. And if I did by mistake, you would be the first person I let go when the work slows down. I don't want to deal with your attitude in addition to the 100+ federal, state, and local law I have to know and obey.

 

[xsledder]

xsledder-

Don't you remember what happened late last week? Indy turned the big 16. He has now seen it all, done it all and know's it all.

Proving it in every post he makes.

"i will not change my opinion"

Just something to chew on for a while Indy... A definition of intelligence is the ability of an organism to adapt to a changing environment.

-John

John,

you had me laughing for three minutes. Thank you, I needed that.

 

[saber1]

Looks like the distraction is working If you want to bitch about people getting paid too much and having great pensions How about we take a look at what a Senator or congressman make or any politician .Almost all of them have to do is get in for one or 2 terms and they are set for life.Example I personally know an alderman in a suburb of Chicago that makes around $65000 a year plus pension and medical and when he retires he will be making around 100000 a year plus medical.As far as teachers are concerned They educate our children do you really want someone making $35000 a year to do that.Ask your self who are the most important people other than your parents, its your children right.If you ask me they do not get paid enough.Also as i look back at my days in school there were one or two teachers that made a difference in my life for the better and that in my mind is priceless.

 

[xsledder]

I wouldn't care about unions if at the end of the contract, the company or gov. agency could either negotiate with them, negotiate with another union, or hire people outside the union.

Also, I wouldn't mind a union if (One can only dream!):

• I could just give a lump sum for the payroll to them and they pay the union member and the union member's Federal Income Tax, State Income Tax, Medicare Tax, and Social Security Tax (or equivalent).
• If I had someone sick or on vacation, they would send me a just as capable replacement until the original person returns.
• They would train the person on the software I use outside of company time.

 

[snowman2]

God please make it SNOW so this all goes away

 

[whitedust]

your right teachers get paid way too much, this is my 3rd year teaching and I make 33,355 a year. way too much, oh and my wife the nurse she is in a union and she makes way too much too. the police liaison officer at school makes way too much 40,000.


the highest paid teacher in our district with 20+yrs of service and a PhD still can only make 65k. dont doctors with PhDs dont even make that much

this guys says it pretty well, really putting us overpaid slackers in our place

"Are you sick of high paid teachers? Teachers’ hefty salaries are driving up taxes, and they only work 9 or 10 months a year! It’s time we put things in perspective and pay them for what they do - baby sit! We can get that for less than minimum wage.

That’s right. Let’s give them $3.00 an hour and only the hours they worked; not any of that silly planning time, or any time they spend before or after school. That would be $19.50 a day (7:45 to 3:00 PM

with 45 min. off for lunch and plan — that equals 6 1/2 hours).



Each parent should pay $19.50 a day for these teachers to baby-sit their children.



Now how many do they teach in day…maybe 30? So that’s $19.50 x 30 = $585.00 a day. However, remember they only work 180 days a year!!! I am not going to pay them for any vacations.



LET’S SEE…. That’s $585 X 180= $105,300 peryear. (Hold on! My calculator needs new batteries).



What about those special education teachers and the ones with Master’s degrees? Well, we could pay them minimum wage ($7.75), and just to be fair, round it off to $8.00 an hour. That would be $8 X 6 1/2 hours X 30 children

X 180 days = $280,800 per year.



Wait a minute — there’s something wrong here! There sure is!



The average teacher’s salary (nation wide) is $50,000. $50,000/180 days = $277.77/per day/30 students=$9.25/6.5 hours = $1.42 per hour per student–a very inexpensive baby-sitter and they even EDUCATE your

kids!)"


oh yea thanks for the support indy!

If you don't think your are being fairly compensated for being a teacher or nurse then move on to something else. If you think most jobs in the private sector are 9-5 salary jobs you are sadly mistaken. If you can do your job in on site hours only GREAT for you but it has never been my pattern in sales & marketing for 35 years. No union!! LOL All of us have boiled compensation down to an hourly rate but to me it does not matter you put in the time necessary to be successful as failure is not an option. Try sales & marketing for a pressure cooker as it is super easy to measure your performance. You either make the numbers or you don't no excuses are permitted & companies don't care what you did for them in the past you live in the now every day,week month & year. If you are good at sales & marketing you will have a favorable reputation in your industry & are upwardly mobile because you are in demand & can become a hired gun to the highest bidder if you are willing to take some risk for change. Lots of pressure if you can take it & good compensation too. I didn't do too bad over all better than some & worse than others. I started out as a Western Electric Installer & I was elected as a CWA union rep by my fellow workers so I have seen life from both sides. I really didn't want to be a union rep but my fellow workers would not take no for an answer & before I knew it I was elected. I'm happy I was CWA union rep as it was a good experience for me & a chance to see labor & management at the table discussing worker/management issues. A real eye opener for me at a young age. To all of you Jders don't feel trapped as a teacher a nurse or a salesperson! You can do whatever you want just have a vision & fulfill that vision. John Dee wanted to be a weather person pursued that dream now this website came along over the years as a favorable result of that dream. No union help there either. You are your own best representative in life so take charge & don't look to others to pull you up when you are down only you can do that!!

 

[catalac]

Ha ha yeah I think the snow is even sick of this crap, cause it is nowhere to be found.
Whatever. I'm going to go watch my eagles.

 

[amo]

Unions are doomed to fail, global economics and the stock shareholder are the culprits. Union labor adds costs that companies can avoid by outsourcing or breaking the union. Reasons often are: to either stay competitive (or in business); report positive earnings to their shareholders (make the numbers), or lose millions of market capital; or just to stay afloat another year.

You need to think big picture here, how will unionized labor survive/compete in a non-unionized global labor market. I can tell you now, it won't survive. The best things unions can do is work on a exit strategy over the next decade and find another way to be an advocate for US labor in a passive manner.

Breaking unions is nothing new, been happening for years and it will continue as businesses in each market reach that critical point where its sink or swim. When it really matters, and people are at risk of losing their jobs, unions will find themselves out of a job instead.

 

[tower11]

Indy 500

I don't ever get involved in these discussions because they are pointless...but I do appreciate your courage for standing up for your opinions. I have been a union member for 33 years. If you could send me your sweatshirt size and an address I would like to send you an official Laborers Union sweatshirt. Thanks for your support.

 

[einne]

and Indy as soon as you put in at least 3 yrs min working and start actually paying the government a % of what you have earned some may start to respect your input on a subject that you currently have 0 personal experience with.after you join your union and start busting your hump with no more recognition or pay than the lump you are covering for is receiving let us know how you feel on the subject

maybe he should start his own website-where the kids can play.

 

[burmad69]

Every one is entitled to their own opinion and Indy might not be as misinformed as you might think, true he has 0 real world experience but he also has the time and resources to study this situation I'm just afraid his judgment might be swayed alittle by his surroundings. He needs to study both sides indepth and make an informed decision them speak smartly about it. Not sticking up for him but not bashing him for his opinion either. Cmon guys he's 16 help him to understand instead of treating him like his opinion doesnt matter. Kids are our future maybe they can do better than we have done in the past.

 

[toby1]

threats

to get back to the first post .we had a local business that was going to let the recall jim holprin crew there for signing up .but they got over 50 theats and had to move to the court house for protection .has it really come to this .so i guess you can an opinion as long as its the same as them .

 

[Hoosier]

x3 If you take away pay AND benefits, they will all go in search of other jobs, they'll find some guy off the street to replace them, and all the kids education goes down the tubes. Are there bad teachers out there? Yes, their are plenty. I'd say 25% of the teachers at my school don't deserve to be paid what they do. But if you don't pay the good teachers any money, there won't be any good teachers left!

Indy - that's one of the main problems is with the teachers unions. The best teachers don't get paid more than the 25% who you identified as not deserving of their pay. Without the union, the best would get paid more.

Also, if you look at the pay stats, the larger cities (Milw) drive up the average, so your teachers probably are lower than the state average. I'm not sure where you are at, but since you talk about driving your sled to school, I'm assuming it's not a city.

 

[felonious_rider]

Very Interesting!!

I have read almost every post in this thread and the most interesting thing about this entire discussion is everyone is pointing the finger at each other not themselves! Sure Politicans, Government employees, Unions, etc. have all contributed their fair share to the done fall of this economy but me and you have also contributed our fair share.

If we are going to survive this change and the down fall of this economy then it starts with me and you and self responsibility. No matter how little or how big we can all contribute!!